Trump's FBI Raid Goes Nuclear

[discolé monade]

On 8/31/2022 at 11:17 AM, scoobdog said:

No they love him because they think everyone is being mean to them... by pointing out their racism.

and those fools don't realize that classism is well in play, and they are the pawns. 

i hope i'm alive when that 'truth' hits the cult of personality. 

[Seight]

7 hours ago, 1pooh4u said:

I’m sure he has a perfectly plausible explanation for that,  that won’t sound crazy to sane people at all 🙃

"I kept them in multiple desks so that I have something to look at in every desk. Please make me President again" 

[SwimModSponges]

8 hours ago, 1pooh4u said:

I noticed the Time Magazine cover that was framed. He’s an egomaniac. It shouldn’t be a surprise that he’d do that 

So... not to spread unsubstantiated rumors... 

But apparently Trump loves giving framed copies of his fake time magazine covers as gifts.

Bet some secret documents would fit real nice in one of those.

[1pooh4u]

10 minutes ago, SwimModSponges said:

So... not to spread unsubstantiated rumors... 

But apparently Trump loves giving framed copies of his fake time magazine covers as gifts.

Bet some secret documents would fit real nice in one of those.

Trump probably had plans to either sell those secrets, or use them to hold the country hostage in some way.  No way was he keeping them just because he thought he could. 

[SwimModSponges]

They've already been sold, 100%

8/3/2019- https://www.salon.com/2019/08/03/trumps-white-house-issues-an-ominous-request-for-a-list-of-top-u-s-spies_partner/

8/7/2021- https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/05/us/politics/cia-informants-killed-captured.html

[scoobdog]

3 hours ago, 1pooh4u said:

Trump probably had plans to either sell those secrets, or use them to hold the country hostage in some way.  No way was he keeping them just because he thought he could. 

If Putin didn't have terminal cancer, he could have waited a couple of years for Trump to "gift" him all the Top Secret intel on Ukraine for the low low price of a complete bailout of the Trump Organization.

[naraku360]

Anyone not blocked by Ginguy want to ping him on this? @katt_goddess he sometimes replies to you.

I need to know what rationale we get for the FBI raid being a witch hunt with first hand testimony from Trump himself saying they spread the classified documents he had on the floor.

[SwimModSponges]

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763.39.1_1.pdf

Lotta "empty folder(s) marked top secret" in there.

Edited September 2, 2022 by SwimModSponges

[Sieg67]

9 hours ago, naraku360 said:

Anyone not blocked by Ginguy want to ping him on this? @katt_goddess he sometimes replies to you.

I need to know what rationale we get for the FBI raid being a witch hunt with first hand testimony from Trump himself saying they spread the classified documents he had on the floor.

I would be shocked that they thought their viewers were stupid enough to believe that defense but they literally are.

Edited September 2, 2022 by Sieg67

[Seight]

7 hours ago, SwimModSponges said:

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763.39.1_1.pdf

Lotta "empty folder(s) marked top secret" in there.

Holy shit, they're so top secret that they're INVISIBLE!

[rpgamer]

6 hours ago, Seight said:

Holy shit, they're so top secret that they're INVISIBLE!

Or just dead and buried. In a fresh grave. On his own property....

[Sieg67]

On 9/2/2022 at 12:30 PM, SwimModSponges said:

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763/gov.uscourts.flsd.618763.39.1_1.pdf

Lotta "empty folder(s) marked top secret" in there.

This is completely unrelated to the thread but I finally looked into what the fuck in in your sig.

It's Burmese peacock softshell turtle.
You would not believe how long that shit has been bugging me.

[SwimModSponges]

Trump appointed judge rules in favor of special master, stops the DOJ probe, and argues thatthe former president should not be able to be indicted due to the fact that it could lead to "reputational harm."

https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/05/politics/trump-special-master-mar-a-lago-ruling/index.html

[stilgar]

I am shocked, shocked.

[Raptorpat]

1 hour ago, SwimModSponges said:

and argues thatthe former president should not be able to be indicted

"... based on the privileged documents"

[Ginguy]

The ruling.

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/22275109-specialmaster_order0905?responsive=1&title=1

 

[Sawdy]

@Raptorpat, give me the cliff notes… I can’t… what’s important here.

[NewBluntsworth]

Makes sense to me. Trump wins again. 

[scoobdog]

1 hour ago, Raptorpat said:

"... based on the privileged documents"

So a nothingburger?  It is a delay tactic to an extent, but if its not affecting any of the confidential documents that would be the centerpiece of an prosecution of him.

[SwimModSponges]

1 hour ago, Sawdy said:

@Raptorpat, give me the cliff notes… I can’t… what’s important here.

"The DOJ is biased and can't be trusted, so we have to appoint an impartial third party to go over all the top secret documents to determine if we violated Trump’s right to privacy by taking them from MAL. Until theyve been reviewed by the "special master" the DOJ is not allowed to continue reviewing them."

[discolé monade]

2 hours ago, Sawdy said:

@Raptorpat, give me the cliff notes… I can’t… what’s important here.

just a stall tactic. 

[Top Gun]

I saw someone point out that this feels extremely pointless because the DoJ has already looked through all of the documents. If this was done beforehand, it might be more significant for him, but the cat's already out of the bag.

[Jman]

This is also sure to collapse on appeal.  Goddamn Federalist society is just stalling.

[SwimModSponges]

Gee, I wonder what they could be buying time for.

[stilgar]

13 minutes ago, SwimModSponges said:

Gee, I wonder what they could be buying time for.

To dig up a shallow grave?

[SwimModSponges]

So hey, just read this, felt like sharing.

On the off chance you couldn't read that-

Quote

It's actually far worse than that. The purpose of the Special Master is to look through the documents and identify anything that could be covered by Trump's attorney-client privilege. (She also specified documents covered by executive privilege as well, but that's so insanely batshit and outside her purview that let's set aside for the moment her contention that a former office-holder can still wield the powers of the office over the objections of the current office holder.)

What she's referring to here is the notion that if any of his personal documents (or presidential records subject to executive privilege) are disclosed to the public, then it could cause him "unquantifiable potential harm." Harm to him personally, not harm to the state (despite her inclusion of documents covered by executive privilege, the fact that executive privilege is intended to protect the office and not the office holder, and the fact that there's a separate court in DC where such claims are investigated, i.e. it's outside of her jurisdiction). And because of that concern, she's issuing an injunction to the DOJ to cease their use of any of the documents for any investigative purpose related to their criminal inquiry until the special master has looked through the documents.

As if potential violations of his personal privacy or damage to his reputation is a greater concern to the state than his wanton disregard for the "unquantifiable potential harm" of his (best case scenario) criminally negligent handling of national security documents, especially given the fact that he's shown bad faith in dealing with the government over the recovery of these documents every step of the way.

Coming back to the question of executive privilege, for fuck's sake, one of the cases she cites as justification for the idea that former Presidents can invoke executive privilege in a situation like this is Nixon v. Administrator of General Services, in which she states that the Supreme Court didn't say that a former President couldn't overrule the current office holder in matters of executive privilege. Just take a second and let it sink in how insane that logic is. Not joking, she wrote, "The Supreme Court did not rule out the possibility of a former President overcoming an incumbent President on executive privilege matters." Take another second, there. They didn't say that he couldn't do it.

And then let's also add to the pile the fact that this is why Congress passed the Presidential Records Act the very next year after this court case: to better codify the process of handling and curating such documents and ensure that criminal presidents couldn't broadly use the excuse of executive privilege to hide evidence of their crimes. In other words, this precedent she's citing (and creating fan fiction out of) is fucking dead in the water anyway because there is now a law on the books that explicitly addresses the question of ownership of Presidential records that would be covered by executive privilege. They belong to the fucking people.

I've never seen a judge so obviously unqualified to hold their seat, and I watched the hearings for Trump's SCOTUS lackeys.

Edit: To everyone who keeps trying to come up with some fanciful way that a SCOTUS ruling in Trump's favor here would mean that Obama can overrule him because he's also a former president. . . I need you to understand that logical "gotcha"s like that do not work on people intent upon seizing power.

The logic of fascism is that they invent the reality that justifies what they want to do, and then they do it. They do not care if that "reality" is true. They do not care what their opponents have to say about it. They do not care if it is logically consistent. It is a philosophy of action, not of thought. That is why it is fundamentally incompatible with liberal democracy, and also, incidentally, why liberal democracies are often so poorly suited at beating back the tide of fascism. You are preparing to show up to a gun fight and leaving even your knife at home, thinking that the law will protect you. The law is a tool of the state. The only thing that protects us from those bullets is the rule of law, not the law itself. Once fascists take over, the law becomes their tool to use as a bludgeon against their enemies.

How many times during Trump's presidency did he find some weakness in our system of governance with that same logic of "the law doesn't technically say I can't do this," or else just ignore the law entirely when there was no enforcement mechanism for it or simply no will to enforce it? And what has happened to him up until now? We all sort of looked at each other, angry and confused, and waited for somebody to do *something.* For the system to act in defense of itself, because, "Surely," we thought, "it can't happen here." But it can, and nobody is coming to save us. The rule of law is eroding and we're not even shoring up our defenses because Democrats don't even have enough power at this point to do so.

Y'all need to vote like your lives depend on it, because once fascism garners a critical mass in the state and attains the monopoly on the legitimate use of violence, resisting it peacefully becomes all but impossible.

 

Edited September 6, 2022 by SwimModSponges

[scoobdog]

Thankfully, that's too small for me to read.

[SwimModSponges]

Fixed it for people with people eyes.

[scoobdog]

1 minute ago, SwimModSponges said:

Fixed it for people with people eyes.

Why?

[SwimModSponges]

Because I felt like sharing.

I mean I prefaced it by saying "hey I read this and felt like sharing."

Kinda answered that question before it was asked.

Edited September 6, 2022 by SwimModSponges

[rpgamer]

What's the point of having his lawyers cite some established precedent when we've already determined, by his own appointed judges, that established precedent can be thrown out on a whim?

[SwimModSponges]

Fascism.

[1pooh4u]

President Jimmy Carter save us and go get your Presidential Privilege that you apparently still have after 50 years cuz some Trump appointed judge said so. 
Also I wish I could steal some shit and then claim the evidence I robbed was privileged therefore they can’t use it. Damn it’s good to have money and absolutely no fuckin morals at all. 

[Sawdy]

1 hour ago, 1pooh4u said:

President Jimmy Carter save us and go get your Presidential Privilege that you apparently still have after 50 years cuz some Trump appointed judge said so. 
Also I wish I could steal some shit and then claim the evidence I robbed was privileged therefore they can’t use it. Damn it’s good to have money and absolutely no fuckin morals at all. 

Doesn’t Obama have it too?

[1pooh4u]

10 minutes ago, Sawdy said:

Doesn’t Obama have it too?

Yeah but that doesn’t go back far enough we must appeal to the oldest living president because their powers of executive privilege are fully charged and much stronger than Obama’s and Trump’s combined.  Obama’s only been not president for 6 years needs to cook more. 

[Sawdy]

2 minutes ago, 1pooh4u said:

Yeah but that doesn’t go back far enough we must appeal to the oldest living president because their powers of executive privilege are fully charged and much stronger than Obama’s and Trump’s combined.  Obama’s only been not president for 6 years needs to cook more. 

 

[1pooh4u]

Trump is goin to get away with all he’s done because whomever is appointed as special master is going to say the most criminal documents are privilege.  He’s not going to jail. He’s going to win in 2024 and let’s say he does get locked up, which he won’t, he’ll run for POTUS from jail.  
When the current POTUS addresses the nation and the complaints are “he used a red background” and “calling  out fascism and fascists for who and what they are is terrible”  you know the country is in trouble.  Does not matter that Biden went out of his way to clarify he’s talking about a loud minority of people. It was still “half the country”

we deserve what we get for all the stupid we’ve allowed 

[SwimModSponges]

34 minutes ago, Sawdy said:

Doesn’t Obama have it too?

Quote

Edit: To everyone who keeps trying to come up with some fanciful way that a SCOTUS ruling in Trump's favor here would mean that Obama can overrule him because he's also a former president. . . I need you to understand that logical "gotcha"s like that do not work on people intent upon seizing power.

The logic of fascism is that they invent the reality that justifies what they want to do, and then they do it. They do not care if that "reality" is true. They do not care what their opponents have to say about it. They do not care if it is logically consistent. It is a philosophy of action, not of thought. That is why it is fundamentally incompatible with liberal democracy, and also, incidentally, why liberal democracies are often so poorly suited at beating back the tide of fascism. You are preparing to show up to a gun fight and leaving even your knife at home, thinking that the law will protect you. The law is a tool of the state. The only thing that protects us from those bullets is the rule of law, not the law itself. Once fascists take over, the law becomes their tool to use as a bludgeon against their enemies.

 

[Sawdy]

3 minutes ago, 1pooh4u said:

Trump is goin to get away with all he’s done because whomever is appointed as special master is going to say the most criminal documents are privilege.  He’s not going to jail. He’s going to win in 2024 and let’s say he does get locked up, which he won’t, he’ll run for POTUS from jail.  
When the current POTUS addresses the nation and the complaints are “he used a red background” and “calling  out fascism and fascists for who and what they are is terrible”  you know the country is in trouble.  Does not matter that Biden went out of his way to clarify he’s talking about a loud minority of people. It was still “half the country”

we deserve what we get for all the stupid we’ve allowed 

As a white male, sadly… I’ll be ok… it’s everyone else I worry about with what is to come…. The ground work has been made, he will come in 2024 and drive his agenda to its fullest…

Very shitty times behind us now, and the worst is yet to come.

[1pooh4u]

Just now, Sawdy said:

As a white male, sadly… I’ll be ok… it’s everyone else I worry about with what is to come…. The ground work has been made, he will come in 2024 and drive his agenda to its fullest…

Very shitty times behind us now, and the worst is yet to come.

Yup. I’m pricing health insurance in Canada jic I can get temporary permission to stay there during his next term.  I better get good at a skill Canadians need 😬

[Sawdy]

Just now, 1pooh4u said:

Yup. I’m pricing health insurance in Canada jic I can get temporary permission to stay there during his next term.  I better get good at a skill Canadians need 😬

Montreal has a nice variety of street walkers… not a bad gig for a short period of time… and you don’t need no pimp

[1pooh4u]

2 minutes ago, Sawdy said:

Montreal has a nice variety of street walkers… not a bad gig for a short period of time… and you don’t need no pimp

I’m too old for that mess maybe I can learn how to cultivate cannabis or harvest it. It’s legal in Canada so maybe they need people to work that industry although I might actually be able to get a job coding in their healthcare system as I’m fairly certain they use the same coding as in the US.  ICD 10 and CPT only pricing would be different (probably)

[SwimModSponges]

Bill Barr: Bullshit.

https://www.businessinsider.com/bill-barr-judges-ruling-was-wrong-in-mar-a-lago-investigation-2022-9

[Seight]

13 hours ago, 1pooh4u said:

Yeah but that doesn’t go back far enough we must appeal to the oldest living president because their powers of executive privilege are fully charged and much stronger than Obama’s and Trump’s combined.  Obama’s only been not president for 6 years needs to cook more. 

INSTRUCTIONS UNCLEAR

PEANUTS FOR EVERYONE!

[matrixman124]

🙃

 

 

[SwimModSponges]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2022/09/06/trump-nuclear-documents/

So now it's international nuclear secrets.

Boy howdy, i hope whatever country’s nuclear secrets Trump stole and left laying around is ok with that.

[NewBluntsworth]

2 minutes ago, SwimModSponges said:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2022/09/06/trump-nuclear-documents/

So now it's international nuclear secrets.

Boy howdy, i hope whatever country’s nuclear secrets Trump stole and left laying around is ok with that.

Eh, I'm sure Israel is ok with people finally "knowing" that we gave them nukes a long time ago. 

[1pooh4u]

So I’m listening to Dr Rashad Richey and apparently during Trump’s final days in office he ordered nuclear reactors on the moon by 2027, and nuclear powered ships to orbit the Earth and space as well as tiny nuclear weapons or reactors small enough so they can be shipped using our highways. If that’s true then it all makes sense now. The papers he took had something to do with his wants and ideas so he thinks they’re his property now to do wtf he wants. 
 

https://www.salon.com/2022/09/08/pushed-for-nuclear-testing-on-the-moon-during-final-months-of-presidency_partner/

[Top Gun]

 

[1pooh4u]

22 minutes ago, Top Gun said:

 

They’re gonna find a dead orca up there named Wiilzyx 💩