2024 Presidential Elections: the schadenfreude commences

[scoobdog]

1 hour ago, matrixman124 said:

Same here. As long as Trump has a fragile ego, he will not accept anything else than the Republican nomination. Anything less and he will sabotage the party. If he can't win, nobody can.

 

I’m sure he will try to sabotage the party.  It will be interesting to see how he pulls it off.

[katt_goddess]

1 hour ago, matrixman124 said:

Same here. As long as Trump has a fragile ego, he will not accept anything else than the Republican nomination. Anything less and he will sabotage the party. If he can't win, nobody can.

 

It really is too bad that Trump's idea of scorched earth isn't just him literally setting himself on fire at some gross 'Freedom' meeting.

[Raptorpat]

 

[matrixman124]

1 hour ago, katt_goddess said:

It really is too bad that Trump's idea of scorched earth isn't just him literally setting himself on fire at some gross 'Freedom' meeting.

If he died, DeSantis and the GOP could martyr him and we would be fucked again.

 

[1pooh4u]

1 hour ago, Raptorpat said:

 

Does it really matter if the senate loses Manchin to a Republican?  He’s always obstructing the democrats anyway would a Republican be any worse or different?

[Raptorpat]

The partisan answer would be that the most important vote any legislator makes is for leader to run the chamber and that everything else they do is secondary. 

Come 2024, Manchin, Tester, and Brown are all up for reelection in Trump-won states, and there are several in tossup states (NV, AZ, and through the rust belt).

If Warnock wins in the Georgia run-off for 51 seats, they can only net-lose one Senate seat and retain the majority (assuming Biden wins too) after 2024. It's very possible that both chambers could flip in opposite directions.

[matrixman124]

Trump has announced his 2024 bid.

The GOP doesn't want him.

Fox News doesn't want him.

But damn it, he is going to piss in everyone's Cheerios and they're going to love it.

I guarantee that if he loses the nomination, he will drag down the GOP with him. It will be glorious.

[Jman]

1 minute ago, matrixman124 said:

Trump has announced his 2024 bid.

The GOP doesn't want him.

Fox News doesn't want him.

But damn it, he is going to piss in everyone's Cheerios and they're going to love it.

I guarantee that if he loses the nomination, he will drag down the GOP with him. It will be glorious.

That's a big "if" admittedly.  The GOP's greatest strength has been voting in lockstep with their guy regardless of any moral failings.

The GOP wants to quit Trump, they wish they could quit Trump, but they may not be able to.

[matrixman124]

1 minute ago, Jman said:

That's a big "if" admittedly.  The GOP's greatest strength has been voting in lockstep with their guy regardless of any moral failings.

The GOP wants to quit Trump, they wish they could quit Trump, but they may not be able to.

Here's the problem: election deniers and MAGA candidates did not do well in the midterms. This was a collosal embarrassment for the GOP. Trump is not a guaranteed success anymore and the leadership knows it. 2020 could have been a one-time thing what with the pandemic but 2022 has been proof that his influence has severely waned.

[matrixman124]

Deranged Trump speech thread hooooooo!

[naraku360]

4 hours ago, 1pooh4u said:

I was reading the comments section of a NY Post article about how Trump was making fun of DeSantis at an event by showing an ad from 5 years ago with Ron’s baby in a MAGA onesie. The comments were all bashing Trump. They are starting to hate him now for the things most people been hating him for 

I want to tie the motherfucker to the GOP like they deserve.

[1pooh4u]

1 minute ago, naraku360 said:

I want to tie the motherfucker to the GOP like they deserve.

He’s running for President or he’s gonna try either DeSantis runs too or the Republicans are gonna get behind Trump 

all the bickering doesn’t mean a damn thing. They’re having a temp break up but they’re gonna get back together real soon. It’s like watching a high school romance 

[matrixman124]

2 minutes ago, 1pooh4u said:

He’s running for President or he’s gonna try either DeSantis runs too or the Republicans are gonna get behind Trump 

all the bickering doesn’t mean a damn thing. They’re having a temp break up but they’re gonna get back together real soon. It’s like watching a high school romance 

I'm telling you, if Trump loses the nomination, it will be a GOP civil war.

[matrixman124]

Qanon already thinks DeSantis is the bad guy.

 

[Jman]

28 minutes ago, matrixman124 said:

Qanon already thinks DeSantis is the bad guy.

 

 

[scoobdog]

2 hours ago, matrixman124 said:

Qanon already thinks DeSantis is the bad guy.

 

They’re turning on Ted Cruz too?  The conspiracy is so convoluted it’s turning on itself.

[naraku360]

3 hours ago, matrixman124 said:

But damn it, he is going to piss in everyone's Cheerios and they're going to love it.

 

[Seight]

It would be funny if after all of this they supported Trump if he were to win the nomination.

wait no i didn't mean "funny" i meant

[Jman]

There’s a pickle for Desantis and friends.  Supporting the investigations and charges against Don and risk pissing off his voters, or risk him splitting everyone apart and losing bigly at the polls?

[scoobdog]

3 hours ago, Jman said:

There’s a pickle for Desantis and friends.  Supporting the investigations and charges against Don and risk pissing off his voters, or risk him splitting everyone apart and losing bigly at the polls?

DeSantis doesn’t have to do anything.  He stays quiet while the investigations are going, like none of it is his business.

[Raptorpat]

You criticize the investigations while hoping they effectively sideline Trump.

[SwimModSponges]

So I think the fact that Trump admitted to using the FBI to steal the 2018 florida election for Desantis and it didn't harm him in the slightest means that his other pieces of Kompromat probably won't matter much at all.

Can't wait until he tweets out the details from Tucker Carlson/Matt Gaetz dinner with a sixteen year old girl he paid for sex, or about how Ted Cruz met Lauren Boebert on a sugar daddy website and paid her for two abortions, and everybody to be all like "Yeah, that's just Trump talking about his/others crimes again, blah blah blah."

[scoobdog]

1 hour ago, Raptorpat said:

You criticize the investigations while hoping they effectively sideline Trump.

 I would agree, but....

1 hour ago, SwimModSponges said:

So I think the fact that Trump admitted to using the FBI to steal the 2018 florida election for Desantis...

...there is some liability there.  I'm sure, part of the reason Trump brought it up even as self-incriminating as it is was because he knew it could be used to tie DeSantis to his own problems.  Right now, DeSantis has to wait until any potential investigation into Trump openly refutes Trump's assertion before he weighs in further.  Besides, there are plenty of Democrats for him to hypocritically demonize without any chance of blowback in his own ranks.

[1pooh4u]

On my way to work I was watching some videos of Trump announcing his bid to run for President he entered the stage to the song “can you hear the people sing?” It’s a song from Les miserable and the song was sung by students and the poor because they were fed up with the rulers of France. It’s the last song a candidate like trump should be using 

Do you hear the people sing?
Singing the song of angry men?
It is the music of the people
Who will not be slaves again!
When the beating of your heart
Echoes the beating of the drums
There is a life about to start
When tomorrow comes!

[Combeferre:]
Will you join in our crusade?
Who will be strong and stand with me?
Beyond the barricade
Is there a world you long to see?

[Courfeyrac:]
Then join in the fight
That will give you the right to be free!

[All:]
Do you hear the people sing?
Singing the song of angry men?
It is the music of the people
Who will not be slaves again!
When the beating of your heart
Echoes the beating of the drums
There is a life about to start
When tomorrow comes!

[Feuilly:]
Will you give all you can give
So that our banner may advance?
Some will fall and some will live
Will you stand up and take your chance?
The blood of the martyrs
Will water the meadows of France!

[All:]
Do you hear the people sing?
Singing the song of angry men?
It is the music of the people
Who will not be slaves again!
When the beating of your heart
Echoes the beating of the drums
There is a life about to start
When tomorrow comes

I mean sure he can use the song they twist the meaning of everything so I suppose this is no different but jfc this is really how Trump sees himself as some sort of savior except he’s a savior for the rich not the average person 

[scoobdog]

Trump is John Milton's Satan.

[Top Gun]

It's like when Republicans try to use "Born in the USA" as a patriotic song.

[Chapinator_X]

Desantis can stay quiet and looking pretty for his supporters, but he knows he owes his entire existence to Trump and needed his support to win in 2018.

The culture war was the only way he could hide the fact that he’s a witless goober who couldn’t win a debate to save his life. The added misfortune that Desantis is a horrible debater and has publicly choked also makes it easy for opponents to claim he lacks the stones to lead the party into the future. 

And winning elections against state Democrats really never prepped him up for having to survive a Trump debate. If he’s mocked for being nothing without MAGA, he’ll make the same mistakes as Cruz and Rubio back when those two were meant to be the party’s future.

[SwimModSponges]

47 minutes ago, Chapinator_X said:

Desantis can stay quiet and looking pretty for his supporters, but he knows he owes his entire existence to Trump and needed his support  him to illegally interfere by publicly having his opponent investigated by the FBI prior to the election to win in 2018.

Fixed that.

Also, yeah, remember what happened to the never-trumpers in 2016? 

Trump is literally the only way forward for the republican party.

[scoobdog]

Dealing with Trump is the only way forward.  Trump isn’t effective as a political boss, so he’s not capable of leading the party.  But, he can still motivate his base to do his bidding. The only way forward for the Republican Party is to defang his acolytes.

[Farg]

6 minutes ago, scoobdog said:

Dealing with Trump is the only way forward.  Trump isn’t effective as a political boss, so he’s not capable of leading the party.  But, he can still motivate his base to do his bidding. The only way forward for the Republican Party is to defang his acolytes.

hey man,vyou got the touch *does it*

[naraku360]

46 minutes ago, scoobdog said:

Dealing with Trump is the only way forward.  Trump isn’t effective as a political boss, so he’s not capable of leading the party.  But, he can still motivate his base to do his bidding. The only way forward for the Republican Party is to defang his acolytes.

We all know Trump is a dumbass incapable of leadership.

It's his critically stupid cultists that don't.

I just want the GOP to fight themselves into nothing.

[scoobdog]

15 minutes ago, naraku360 said:

We all know Trump is a dumbass incapable of leadership.

It's his critically stupid cultists that don't.

I just want the GOP to fight themselves into nothing.

They will.  The GOP won’t survive this, at least not in its current form, and I think the Christian reich will be the ones that end up on the outside.

[1pooh4u]

Sinema left the democrat party and went independent after all that shit Dems went through to get a majority they still have it but will need Kamala Harris and Sinema just made Manchin the most powerful democrat in the senate now so basically the republicans have the majority but just not on paper 

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/arizonas-sinema-switches-political-affiliation-independent-politico-2022-12-09/

she should just go Republican she basically was one anyway 🙄
 

(did not make a separate thread because this is related in a way to the midterms that are now over)

[Master-Debater131]

All this time Ive been doing Manchin Watch and it turns out I should have been Searching for Sinema.

[1pooh4u]

23 minutes ago, Master-Debater131 said:

All this time Ive been doing Manchin Watch and it turns out I should have been Searching for Sinema.

We all knew it was gonna be one or the other, maybe even both. It really doesn’t matter because they both were always going to make things difficult anyway now nothing will get accomplished AGAIN 

[Master-Debater131]

4 minutes ago, 1pooh4u said:

We all knew it was gonna be one or the other, maybe even both. It really doesn’t matter because they both were always going to make things difficult anyway now nothing will get accomplished AGAIN 

Theres still no guarantee that Manchin doesnt jump ship either. He got stabbed in the back over his deal with Schumer earlier this year. He could pull the same move as Sinema and return the favor if he wanted.

[1pooh4u]

37 minutes ago, Master-Debater131 said:

Theres still no guarantee that Manchin doesnt jump ship either. He got stabbed in the back over his deal with Schumer earlier this year. He could pull the same move as Sinema and return the favor if he wanted.

“Stabbed in the back” gtfoh Manchin and Sinema have been the monkey wrench to every bill the democrats put forward fuck any loyalty to Manchin he degaf about his own constituents 

[naraku360]

1 hour ago, Master-Debater131 said:

He got stabbed in the back

Cool!

[naraku360]

4 hours ago, 1pooh4u said:

she should just go Republican she basically was one anyway 🙄

I'd rather she went to hell instead.

And took Manchin with her.

[1pooh4u]

Sinema is such a lying bitch she said “Arizonans sent her to the senate to be an independent voice” that’s not true at all they voted for her to be a progressive democrat voice, she presented herself one way and behaved contrary to that once she was elected. Hopefully Arizonans drop her in ‘24.  

[Master-Debater131]

Its going to be easier said than done to drop her. She knew the primary challenge was already coming, and that she probably would lose it. By going Independent now shes basically daring the Democrats to run against her and split that vote giving that Senate seat to the GOP. Its a pure power play on her part, and its well executed. By going independent now she doesnt have to worry about being labeled as a sore loser trying to split the party when she loses a primary, instead she can start to define herself as an independent.

Shes not popular with a lot of Democrats in Arizona, but she is popular enough to split the vote. You are already seeing the Democratic establishment play nice with her because they realize what 2024 now looks like in Arizona. Theres a very real chance that Democratic infighting in 2024 will cost them a Senate seat in the same way GOP infighting has doomed them the last few elections.

Lot of people here wont like that. But 2024 is shaping up to be either Sinema or a GOP Senator. No chance a hardcore Progressive Dem wins with her running as a 3rd party now. She will peel off just enough votes to hand it to the GOP.

[scoobdog]

11 hours ago, 1pooh4u said:

Sinema left the democrat party and went independent after all that shit Dems went through to get a majority they still have it but will need Kamala Harris and Sinema just made Manchin the most powerful democrat in the senate now so basically the republicans have the majority but just not on paper 

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/arizonas-sinema-switches-political-affiliation-independent-politico-2022-12-09/

she should just go Republican she basically was one anyway 🙄
 

(did not make a separate thread because this is related in a way to the midterms that are now over)

She's hasn't participated in party meetings for quite some time, so not a whole lot is going to change.

She's really doing it because she knows she's going to get primaried out of the next election.

[1pooh4u]

44 minutes ago, scoobdog said:

She's hasn't participated in party meetings for quite some time, so not a whole lot is going to change.

She's really doing it because she knows she's going to get primaried out of the next election.

Well, she’s not getting primaried out anymore 

and to MDs point about her peelings votes off of democrats it’s possible she could pull votes off republicans too because her record isn’t a secret and it depends who runs on the republican ticket

Funny I saw a poll and it showed no one likes her no demographic at all 😆

[scoobdog]

2 hours ago, 1pooh4u said:

Well, she’s not getting primaried out anymore 

and to MDs point about her peelings votes off of democrats it’s possible she could pull votes off republicans too because her record isn’t a secret and it depends who runs on the republican ticket

Funny I saw a poll and it showed no one likes her no demographic at all 😆

She isn't very popular no.  In all likelihood, she has to bank on there not being a popular democratic rival and, well, a non Trumpian Republican, but the play is pretty sound.  She's setting herself up as the alternative to either extreme in a polarized political landscape and there is plenty of evidence that voters will respond well to that.  Also, there's no chance of her caucusing with the Republicans because her seniority is still with the Democrats, meaning they're the only ones she will have much of a chance of negotiating with if she wants something done (like her latest immigration bill).

[Raptorpat]

7 hours ago, Master-Debater131 said:

Its going to be easier said than done to drop her. She knew the primary challenge was already coming, and that she probably would lose it. By going Independent now shes basically daring the Democrats to run against her and split that vote giving that Senate seat to the GOP. Its a pure power play on her part, and its well executed.

This is 100% the answer.

Her OG strategy was that she needed to be a John McCain maverick to win in a red state but Mark Kelly just proved that's not true, so now her backup strategy to remain in office is to outright hold the party hostage.

[Raptorpat]

Also I bumped the Sinema talk to the 2024 thread because it's her election year and I'm tentatively pegging this as a purely electoral play.

She's made no indication that she's leaving the conference as there's no benefit to immediately burning all those bridges, so her independent enrollment is more akin to Angus King or Bernie Sanders. (Though I expect her to be highly transactional if she is in a position to leverage her seat for partisan control, or maybe just seek to join the GOP conference if it wins a majority without her.)

[Seight]

10 hours ago, 1pooh4u said:

Well, she’s not getting primaried out anymore 

and to MDs point about her peelings votes off of democrats it’s possible she could pull votes off republicans too because her record isn’t a secret and it depends who runs on the republican ticket

Funny I saw a poll and it showed no one likes her no demographic at all 😆

She's set herself up for a dramatic irony of "Republicans don't like her because she's a Democrat, Democrats don't like her because she isn't."

[Master-Debater131]

15 hours ago, 1pooh4u said:

Well, she’s not getting primaried out anymore 

and to MDs point about her peelings votes off of democrats it’s possible she could pull votes off republicans too because her record isn’t a secret and it depends who runs on the republican ticket

Funny I saw a poll and it showed no one likes her no demographic at all 😆

If the GOP nominate another complete wacko then theres a real chance that a significant enough number of GOP voters flip to Sinema and she outright wins another term.

Her move isnt as crazy as it sounds. Theres a very real chance that it works for her in 2024 and she wins another term.

[matrixman124]

11 hours ago, Raptorpat said:

Also I bumped the Sinema talk to the 2024 thread because it's her election year and I'm tentatively pegging this as a purely electoral play.

She's made no indication that she's leaving the conference as there's no benefit to immediately burning all those bridges, so her independent enrollment is more akin to Angus King or Bernie Sanders. (Though I expect her to be highly transactional if she is in a position to leverage her seat for partisan control, or maybe just seek to join the GOP conference if it wins a majority without her.)

Her only motivation seems to be corporate funding. This makes me think this is coming from corporate interests that don't want the Democrats to have a significant lead over the Republicans in Congress.

[matrixman124]

18 minutes ago, Master-Debater131 said:

If the GOP nominate another complete wacko then theres a real chance that a significant enough number of GOP voters flip to Sinema and she outright wins another term.

Her move isnt as crazy as it sounds. Theres a very real chance that it works for her in 2024 and she wins another term.

When have GOP voters ever flipped to Democrat? They'll vote for the whackos as long as they have a GOP stamp of approval. *Gestures to Walker*