2024 Presidential Elections: the schadenfreude commences

[Raptorpat]

i definitely had no idea what you were replying to for a hot second

[Belize]

Progressives' take on Biden. 

The strategy headlined by Ocasio-Cortez and Sanders is not unanimously popular across the progressive universe, some of which remains skeptical of aligning too closely with the president. But it reflects both the increasingly cagey approach to Washington politics adapted by some on the left during Biden’s presidency and an understanding, according to multiple sources familiar with internal conversations, that calling now for Biden to quit the race would have little effect on his decision while offering fodder for outside groups – as they did in working to oust Rep. Jamaal Bowman – to accuse progressives of being disloyal to the president and the party.

“Even if we have been strong critics of Biden, especially over the Gaza stuff before the debate, it is not to our advantage, both in terms of being effectual in removing him or having him withdraw, to be the loudest ones calling for him to withdraw,” said one Democratic strategist in close contact with several progressive offices. “That would only backfire on them and actually maybe help him stay in power.”

Minnesota Rep. Ilhan Omar told CNN on Tuesday that conversation around Biden’s fate is all but over. He will be the nominee, she said, and anyone who thinks otherwise is living “in an alternate universe.”

[1pooh4u]

Omfg this thread 

[Raptorpat]

idk how to believe Tester and Sherrod Brown don't know how to win elections

[Belize]

5 minutes ago, 1pooh4u said:

Omfg this thread 

I know, right?

Bernie and AOC for Biden is weird.

[1pooh4u]

You saying AOC and Bernie are for Biden is funny. Bernie is being old school practical and AOC isn’t the same member of congress that she was however many years ago it was that she’s been elected. Lately seems like she bows to the establishment pretty often.  
 

I get the need to cope. I was doing it too. Looking on the bright side. I still say the entire debate wasn’t terrible but there was a lot more incoherent moments than lucid ones. 

[Belize]

16 minutes ago, 1pooh4u said:

You saying AOC and Bernie are for Biden is funny. Bernie is being old school practical and AOC isn’t the same member of congress that she was however many years ago it was that she’s been elected. Lately seems like she bows to the establishment pretty often.  
 

I get the need to cope. I was doing it too. Looking on the bright side. I still say the entire debate wasn’t terrible but there was a lot more incoherent moments than lucid ones. 

I'm being "old school practical" as well. I think it's likely Biden will *not* drop out of the race. I don't think he's going to allow himself to be pushed out. 

Which would be good news. The only time I've ever felt threatened by Trump returning, so far, is with the idea of Biden dropping out. And if Biden stays, it'll be a relief. 

 

 

[rpgamer]

So, you're telling us there isn't a single alternative pick you would feel more optimistic about? I mean.. setting aside that none have even really stepped forward.... there's not a single hypothetical dream candidate you're secretly hoping comes along to get the base fired up again?

Obviously at this moment, there's no one poised to be that candidate, so a lot of the debate amounts to nothing if nobody is stepping up..

But.. saying this is literally the best we can do feels... kinda grim.

[naraku360]

52 minutes ago, Belize said:

I know, right?

Bernie and AOC for Biden is weird.

It isn't weird at all. You're shadowboxing with people who are already blue down ballot voters. Like, nobody here is going to vote for Trump out of fear that Biden is going to croak. He could already be dead and we'd still vote for him as an anti-Trump statement. I'd take Kamala over Trump, and I'd probably prefer Biden based on his current record over Kamala. We all unanimously hate the GOP more than the DNC, no matter how much they desperately want to change that. You've said yourself that you think this election is won by Biden already and the debate won't change that, so I don't see the harm in venting grievances.

I've only held back on Biden for the simple fact that we had possible holdouts here. With the exception of MD, any staunch MAGA loyalists have realized that we aren't stupid enough to fall for their shrinking cult.

We know Trump is far too dangerous to allow in office. It's like a dozen people on a desolate message board. Loosen up.

[Belize]

1 minute ago, rpgamer said:

So, you're telling us there isn't a single alternative pick you would feel more optimistic about? I mean.. setting aside that none have even really stepped forward.... there's not a single hypothetical dream candidate you're secretly hoping comes along to get the base fired up again?

Obviously at this moment, there's no one poised to be that candidate, so a lot of the debate amounts to nothing if nobody is stepping up..

But.. saying this is literally the best we can do feels... kinda grim.

 

To directly answer your question, I have no specific alternative pick in mind. If we're talking about who my idealistic candidate for president would be, I'd have to think about it. But if I did, I would have supported them in the Democratic primaries. Not now, four months before the election. Because there is a proper time and place for doing that. 

I don't know what you mean by "grim" but if it's about Biden's merits and accomplishments, I think the president who has done the most to respond to climate change is the opposite of grim. I'm thankful a president is actually trying to keep warming below 1.5 degrees Celsius (relative to pre-industrial times). 

I'm excited to support that president. 

 

The Biden Administration Has Taken More Climate Action Than Any Other in History - Center for American Progress

[Belize]

6 minutes ago, naraku360 said:

It isn't weird at all. You're shadowboxing with people who are already blue down ballot voters. Like, nobody here is going to vote for Trump out of fear that Biden is going to croak. He could already be dead and we'd still vote for him as an anti-Trump statement. I'd take Kamala over Trump, and I'd probably prefer Biden based on his current record over Kamala. We all unanimously hate the GOP more than the DNC, no matter how much they desperately want to change that. You've said yourself that you think this election is won by Biden already and the debate won't change that, so I don't see the harm in venting grievances.

I've only held back on Biden for the simple fact that we had possible holdouts here. With the exception of MD, any staunch MAGA loyalists have realized that we aren't stupid enough to fall for their shrinking cult.

We know Trump is far too dangerous to allow in office. It's like a dozen people on a desolate message board. Loosen up.

 

You know what? That's a really good post. 

[[classic swim]]

10 minutes ago, naraku360 said:

You've said yourself that you think this election is won by Biden already and the debate won't change that,

Remember to lay into this cocksucker nice and good by November when he helps get Trump elected. 

[naraku360]

5 minutes ago, [classic swim] said:

Remember to lay into this cocksucker nice and good by November when he helps get Trump elected. 

What did you just call me?!

 

[[classic swim]]

*that

[scoobdog]

54 minutes ago, rpgamer said:

So, you're telling us there isn't a single alternative pick you would feel more optimistic about? I mean.. setting aside that none have even really stepped forward.... there's not a single hypothetical dream candidate you're secretly hoping comes along to get the base fired up again?

Obviously at this moment, there's no one poised to be that candidate, so a lot of the debate amounts to nothing if nobody is stepping up..

But.. saying this is literally the best we can do feels... kinda grim.

I don’t know if it’s grim, but there’s a reason there aren’t any “dream” candidates.  The superstars of the progressive movement are working at the munincipal / district and, occasionally, state level in states that don’t have a major metropolitan region.  The issues that are most important to Democrats are regionally located, even if they’re more or less universal, because those issues interconnect at the local level.

[rpgamer]

Tbh, the "grim" comment came about as I said out loud (in my head) "Biden is the best candidate we can get."

That just sounded like a depressing realization. It ain't strictly bad, it's just... not something to feel excited about.

[Raptorpat]

Quote

But that’s not all Pelosi has been up to: In private conversations with lawmakers, we’re told, the former speaker hasn’t tried to hide her disdain for the situation that party now finds itself in. She’s suggested to people that Biden won’t win this November and should step aside, according to about a half-dozen lawmakers and others who have spoken with her or are familiar with these conversations.

In fact, she’s advised some Democrats in swing districts to do whatever they have to do to secure their own reelections — even if it means asking Biden to relinquish his place atop the ticket.

Pelosi has advised those members, however, to wait until this week’s NATO Summit is finished out of respect for Biden and national security writ large. Some members, we’re told, have already started drafting statements of what they want to say, ready to drop once foreign leaders leave town.

For members who aren’t in swing districts, Pelosi has encouraged them to take their pleas for Biden to step aside directly to the White House or the campaign so as to minimize public fighting. We’re told that some have tried but have not been able to get through to the president.

https://www.politico.com/newsletters/playbook/2024/07/11/what-obama-and-pelosi-are-doing-about-biden-00167520

[Master-Debater131]

10 hours ago, [classic swim] said:

Remember to lay into this cocksucker nice and good by November when he helps get Trump elected. 

Did someone say cocksucker?

 

For those who dont know, that guy on the right is Harry Sisson. The single most shameless Biden supporter on the internet. 

[Belize]

Something that will have a greater effect on the outcome on November than what Sen. Peter Welch of Vermont thinks:

 

 

 

Edited July 11 by Belize

[Jman]

The NY Times is claiming the Biden campaign is doing some preliminary tests to see how Kamala stacks against Biden vs Trump.  Might be where that one preliminary poll that says she beats Trump came from.

[Master-Debater131]

 

He literally did the thing!

 

 

This is absolutely hilarious.

 

[matrixman124]

1 hour ago, Jman said:

The NY Times is claiming the Biden campaign is doing some preliminary tests to see how Kamala stacks against Biden vs Trump.  Might be where that one preliminary poll that says she beats Trump came from.

It's very weird all and all. I'd love to see more info about it 

[scoobdog]

11 hours ago, rpgamer said:

Tbh, the "grim" comment came about as I said out loud (in my head) "Biden is the best candidate we can get."

That just sounded like a depressing realization. It ain't strictly bad, it's just... not something to feel excited about.

I get that, and you're not wrong.  I really feel like it's easy to overlook a lot of the workshopping these young local politicians are doing, because the dysfunction and an absence of tangible gains wears on patience.  The current progressive movement is in its infancy at a time when its platform centers on increasingly urgent issues; it's why an otherwise caretaker Biden administration has outsized emotions attached to it.  We really shouldn't be feeling excited about the prospect of four more years of stalemate, just hopeful that we've bought enough time to see results in cities like New York and Los Angeles that can be carried to the national level.

[Master-Debater131]

 

 

The renewed push by Democrats to make Project 2025 a central piece of the election has started a ripple effect with memes like the one posted above flooding the internet.

The above also has as much chance of happening as P2025 does. In other words, both are total crap and nothing more than a fever dream of some people with way to much time on their hands.

[[classic swim]]

6 hours ago, Master-Debater131 said:

Did someone say cocksucker?

 

 

[stilgar]

Of course md has to post about how project 2025 won't happen and can't happen because if she acknowledged it she'd realize that the party she supports hates her guts. 

[Raptorpat]

big boy press conference in less than ten minutes ???

Edited July 11 by Raptorpat
shit never starts on time

[katt_goddess]

22 hours ago, Raptorpat said:

i definitely had no idea what you were replying to for a hot second

Towards you about kicking a pelvis - I can easily kick a pelvis so hard there isn't much left. I just have to be mad enough and let's face it, some fascist creeper smirking at me and going on about how fighting back against them is wrong deserves an immediate double testiclectomy for the good of all society. 

And towards MD's comment about how Biden saying he'll accept a loss somehow means that any stated concerns about a second Dumpster administration are overblown. Nope, it's pointblank a statement that apparently needs to be made now that we've officially had a jackass refuse to participate in the peaceful transfer of power that's been part of the US since the start of frickin' Presidents and said jackass is running again. 

 

And for the fun of the thread in general, 'the right to bear memes' user on x is so far up orange anuses himself that he would, unironically, do a bad photoshop of Biden's head on Drumpf's body in one of Epstein's confiscated photos and totally claim its not photoshop, it's totally Biden raping underaged girls that happen to look like Ivana.  

And Aristophanes has yet to meet or make up a controversary he can't milk. Please feel free to note the Blue Anus checkmarks on their names that denote they are very important people as long as the checks keep clearing to the Melon Husk charity. 

[Raptorpat]

"any moment" has been literally an hour so far

edit: starting now

Edited July 11 by Raptorpat

[naraku360]

3 hours ago, Master-Debater131 said:

 

 

The renewed push by Democrats to make Project 2025 a central piece of the election has started a ripple effect with memes like the one posted above flooding the internet.

The above also has as much chance of happening as P2025 does. In other words, both are total crap and nothing more than a fever dream of some people with way to much time on their hands.

Eat shit, fuckface.

[Jman]

I saw Smiling Friends memes for the press conference.

Yeah, shit is worse.

[Raptorpat]

1 hour ago, Raptorpat said:

big boy press conference in less than ten minutes ???

the teleprompter speech seemed wholly adequate. his first Q&A he jumbled his words about picking his VP running against Trump and referred to Kamala as "Vice President Trump"

the rest of his answers seem adequate so far.

 

my general thought is that this isn't moving the needle in either direction. he's showing he's not out of it, but he's also showing the occasional trip-up that underpins the accusations.

[Jman]

4 minutes ago, Raptorpat said:

the teleprompter speech seemed wholly adequate. his first Q&A he jumbled his words about picking his VP running against Trump and referred to Kamala as "Vice President Trump"

the rest of his answers seem adequate so far.

 

my general thought is that this isn't moving the needle in either direction. he's showing he's not out of it, but he's also showing the occasional trip-up that underpins the accusations.

Problem is everyone jumped on the slip ups.

[tsar4]

3 minutes ago, Jman said:

Problem is everyone jumped on the slip ups.

Apparently earlier today, Biden referred to Zelenskyy as "President Putin".

[Raptorpat]

yes, and the jumbling was in the first answer

this will probably salvage his candidacy in the near term, but it won't kill the narrative

[Raptorpat]

1 minute ago, tsar4 said:

Apparently earlier today, Biden referred to Zelenskyy as "President Putin".

 

[matrixman124]

3 minutes ago, Raptorpat said:

 

He also called Kamala Vice President Trump

Not a good time for these verbal gaffes

[tsar4]

8 minutes ago, matrixman124 said:

He also called Kamala Vice President Trump

Not a good time for these verbal gaffes

I get it though.  "Don't screw up don't screw up don't screw up don't screw up" with everybody watching your every move and BANG!  

[scoobdog]

I'm just going to post this here from the other thread:

Quote

From The Los Angeles Times

Column: These doctors believe Biden has a neurological disorder. So what now?

By Steve Lopez

July 9, 2024 Updated 5:49 PM PT

The shared view among the doctors who contacted me is that President Biden is not simply getting older; they believe he’s a man with a serious medical condition.

President Biden keeps pushing back.

He’s not going anywhere, he defiantly insists, and claims he feels just fine.

But I’ve been hearing from doctors who saw Biden muddle through the June 27 debate and think he's anything but fine. One of them told me he’s certain Biden is suffering from a movement disorder for which there is no cure.

A diagnosis by someone who has not examined a patient is speculative. But the shared view among the doctors who contacted me is that we are not looking at a man who’s simply getting older. We’re looking at a man with a serious medical condition.

In a recent column, I wrote that no one can accurately diagnose dementia from afar. But doctors tell me neurological movement disorders can be easier to detect.

“Every physician I have spoken to agrees that Biden has classic symptoms of Parkinson’s,” one of the doctors said.

Another noted the “masked face, blank expression, stopping as he shuffles along, soft, hoarse speech and stiff arms as he walks — all Parkinson’s.”

Two additional responses were of particular interest because they came from neurologists with decades of experience. So on Monday, just after the New York Times reported that a Parkinson’s specialist visited the White House eight times in eight months, I called them.

“When I was watching the debate,” said Dr. Michael Mahler, who’s on the UCLA faculty, “there were clues to me” that Biden, 81, was probably dealing with more than the normal challenges of aging.

The first sign for Mahler was “the way he walked onto the stage, with a very stiff gait. Normally, the way people walk, they swing their arms, and he didn’t have much arm swing. Then, watching and listening to him, he had … almost no facial expression…. His blink rate was really, really low, and he had very few other movements.”

Mahler noted Biden’s muffled speech as well. He said he couldn’t make a definitive diagnosis without a full physical, lab work, medication history and a five- to six-hour neurological battery of tests. But he said that what he saw were symptoms in the “Parkinsonian” paradigm.

Dr. Jack Florin, a Fullerton neurologist who’s been practicing medicine for 50 years, told me he has noticed signs of an advancing movement disorder in Biden for several years, and they were accentuated during the debate.

For Florin, there’s no doubt what’s going on: He thinks Biden has a Parkinson’s variant called progressive supranuclear palsy (PSP). He noted that singer Linda Ronstadt has the same condition, as did the late actor Dudley Moore.

“When you have PSP, your eye movements are not normal,” Florin said. “You’re looking down and you have difficulty moving your eyes from side to side. People with PSP have what’s called a fixed stare, and it looked like he was just staring, because his eyes were not moving.”

Over the course of his career, Florin said, he’s had hundreds of PSP patients. In Biden, he said, other telling symptoms included “low volume and rapid speech with loss of normal rhythm,” as well as “episodes of sudden forced eye closure,” also known as blepharospasm.

In Biden’s stiff gait, Florin saw another clue.

“He doesn’t have idiopathic Parkinson’s. That’s the most common type. People are stooped, often they have a tremor, and usually it’s on one side more than another. He doesn’t have that,” Florin said.

In his opinion, Biden has PSP, which is “progressive, incurable and untreatable…. As it gets worse, postural instability is the main problem, and there’s a risk of falls. After a while, patients cannot safely walk. A cane or walker won’t really help, because you can fall over backwards. As the disease gets severely worse, you’re mainly confined to a wheelchair.”

Two other doctors who contacted me did not rule out the possibility that Biden’s problems during the debate could have been caused — at least partially — by the side effects of medication.

“I certainly couldn’t diagnose him,” said Dr. Laura Mosqueda, a USC geriatrician who worries that people will incorrectly make the diagnosis that the president's problem is his age, even though the world has no shortage of fully functioning people far older than Biden. “I don’t care if it’s 81, 61 or 41. I don’t think this is about his age. It’s about — does he have a medical problem we ought to be aware of?”

And that’s the right question.

Just four months shy of election day, the presidential election comes down to a choice between someone we know and someone we don’t know.

Trump, we know, and many people consider him the greater threat to the republic. And it’s no surprise that readers keep asking me why he’s not the candidate whose party wants to put him out to pasture.

Biden, we used to know, but a stranger is now wearing his suits.

He owes it to voters and his own party to undergo a full physical, cognitive and neurological workup and to make the results public. If there’s a problem, it needs to be addressed, with courage and transparency.

For his sake, and ours.

You don't have to read it again, but it definitely had me looking for the PSP traits the doctors in the article mention, particularly the one about his eye movement and his vocalization.  Jury's still out after just this news conference.

[matrixman124]

8 minutes ago, tsar4 said:

I get it though.  "Don't screw up don't screw up don't screw up don't screw up" with everybody watching your every move and BANG!  

Honestly the guy has a stutter and it's gotten worse as he's gotten older. People should not just be focusing on that. Focus on his policies and his actual shortcomings.

In 2020, we all talked about pushing Biden left and now everyone is more focused on his age than focusing on pushing him left!

Because he is a status quo vote!

[1pooh4u]

Biden is done. Too many congressional democrats are starting to come out of the woodwork saying he’s not fit for 4 more years.  I don’t see a way where he’s the candidate in November. Not if democracy is at stake, like they say.  He can’t remain the candidate simply because we’re gonna vote for him regardless because Trump can’t be allowed to take that office again.  Trump wins in November and this country will suffer for a long time.  We are already in trouble from his first stint in office. 

[naraku360]

9 minutes ago, 1pooh4u said:

Trump can’t be allowed to take that office again.

C-A-R-D-I-A-C A-R-R-E-S-T!

HEY! HO! CHOLESTEROL, LETS GO!

 

[Belize]

One of my favorite moments in presidential debates.

 

 

 

 

Edited July 12 by Belize

[1pooh4u]

3 minutes ago, naraku360 said:

C-A-R-D-I-A-C A-R-R-E-S-T!

HEY! HO! CHOLESTEROL, LETS GO!

 

1-2-3-4 we can’t take Trump anymore!

5-6-7-8 let’s get his heart rate to 268!

[naraku360]

1 minute ago, Belize said:

 

 

GET A ROOM, YOU TWO!

[Belize]

8 minutes ago, naraku360 said:

GET A ROOM, YOU TWO!

I think it's a good summary of tonight's press conference. 

[naraku360]

5 minutes ago, Belize said:

I think it's a good summary of tonight's press conference. 

Joe was that horny?

Huh, who would've guessed he could still do that?

[discolé monade]

27 minutes ago, 1pooh4u said:

Biden is done. Too many congressional democrats are starting to come out of the woodwork saying he’s not fit for 4 more years.  I don’t see a way where he’s the candidate in November. Not if democracy is at stake, like they say.  He can’t remain the candidate simply because we’re gonna vote for him regardless because Trump can’t be allowed to take that office again.  Trump wins in November and this country will suffer for a long time.  We are already in trouble from his first stint in office. 

and everything moves according to plan. i am in complete agreement that the democratic party SHOULD have been MORE focused on trump's performance, 

instead of pointing out that the scotus ruling, the project 2025 and trump's continued lying and manipulation. no one is talking about his latest speech in florida, where he went on one of his nonsensical journeys. no, the dems helped continue an already divided party. 

it's really wild, and extrordinary, and fantastic to watch this history. and it frightens me. 

 

[Belize]

 

 

[naraku360]

6 minutes ago, discolé monade said:

and everything moves according to plan. i am in complete agreement that the democratic party SHOULD have been MORE focused on trump's performance, 

instead of pointing out that the scotus ruling, the project 2025 and trump's continued lying and manipulation. no one is talking about his latest speech in florida, where he went on one of his nonsensical journeys. no, the dems helped continue an already divided party. 

it's really wild, and extrordinary, and fantastic to watch this history. and it frightens me. 

 

The problem is that they spent years focusing on Trump's cognitive problems so hard for so long instead of the more important policy issues and now nothing the Democrat mainstream outlets aren't really taken seriously.

Trump's debate performance wasn't exactly stunning. He couldn't capitalize on any of Biden's gaffs from what I saw, and that's a pretty low bar in a debate of this..... caliber.