naraku360 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 1 hour ago, scoobdog said: It kind of is, only because it's presuming he's ill when he's not. But that isn't really the point: people aren't just saying he's old and slow as would be appropriate for his age, they're calling him senile and demented. Bullshit. He's 81 years old. Health concerns are 1000% justified, and when the debate is like watching a pair of geriatric drunkards nuh-uh at each other, when Trump is the easiest target in human history, then no, I don't think he's fit to run the office. If you can't beat an absolute clown like Trump in a debate, get the fuck out. You can tell from Trump's mannerisms that he's unfit for office. If he can't deal with clown school with softball questions, I don't have confidence he's capable of dealing with actual serious people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 16 minutes ago, naraku360 said: He doesn't look like someone who will be around for 4 more years. He's 81 years old. He looks and acts 81 years old. I don't think you can seriously call Biden's mannerisms a "stutter." That's openly dishonest. He wasn't this bad 4 years ago, and he wasn't as bad as 4 years ago when he was VP. It is a decline and you are lying, either to yourself or otherwise, to say it isn't what it obviously is to anyone with half a brain cell. This isn't a fucking stutter. A stutter is tripping over words. It isn't going into completely incoherent ramblings. Quit lying. Sure thing, doctor. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobdog Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 5 minutes ago, naraku360 said: Bullshit. He's 81 years old. Health concerns are 1000% justified, and when the debate is like watching a pair of geriatric drunkards nuh-uh at each other, when Trump is the easiest target in human history, then no, I don't think he's fit to run the office. If you can't beat an absolute clown like Trump in a debate, get the fuck out. You can tell from Trump's mannerisms that he's unfit for office. If he can't deal with clown school with softball questions, I don't have confidence he's capable of dealing with actual serious people. He's been dealing with world leaders for 4 year now. If you think he isn't going to be President for 4 more years, that's fine - he is old and no one has been older in the Presidency ever. But Queen Elizabeth II kept a full schedule into her 90s, so there;s clearly a difference between being old and being infirmed. And, I have no idea what you expected him to do to Trump - maybe break out a baseball bat and start bashing his head in? Trump was lying through his teeth about everything; you don't debate a liar, you beat the shit out of him or you don't engage him at all. Frankly, I could have told you the debate was a bad idea from when it was announced. Both candidates acted like they always act. It was always going to be a fool's errand to have a debate with a known liar and person who not only shows clear signs of dementia but actually has dementia in his family (Fred died with dementia). Yet, you apparently expected Biden to do what to him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naraku360 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 21 minutes ago, Belize said: Sure thing, doctor. Is 81 years old a young, commonly healthy age? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naraku360 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 18 minutes ago, scoobdog said: Yet, you apparently expected Biden to do what to him? Form full sentences that answered the questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raptorpat Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 5 hours ago, MasqueradeOverture said: Never trust anything with a CEO who is the boss at Old MacDonald's farm? the C-I-E-I-O 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[classic swim] Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 Yeah it is kinda annoying to have a candidate who was fully grown during Jim Crow times. But we also have the nice, young, capable voters to thank for inevitably choosing to torch our democracy with the other one no matter what. Maybe age is just a number after all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naraku360 Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 4 minutes ago, [classic swim] said: Yeah it is kinda annoying to have a candidate who was fully grown during Jim Crow times. But we also have the nice, young, capable voters to thank for inevitably choosing to torch our democracy with the other one no matter what. Maybe age is just a number after all! Yeah, but we have to be a doctor to see the walking dead from prehistory may be looking a bit like the Crypt Keeper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobdog Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 2 minutes ago, naraku360 said: Yeah, but we have to be a doctor to see the walking dead from prehistory may be looking a bit like the Crypt Keeper. So, you’ll vote for Harris when she replaces Biden on the ticket, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[classic swim] Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 1 minute ago, naraku360 said: Yeah, but we have to be a doctor to see the walking dead from prehistory may be looking a bit like the Crypt Keeper. I agree with you that he fucking sucks. I’m just past blaming strictly him for why some of us aren’t gonna live to 2028. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1pooh4u Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 (edited) I don’t think it’s ageist to be concerned about the mental capacity of either candidate. They are both old and only now are media outlets releasing reports from “those closest to Biden” who have had concerns about his mental health for the last year. When McConnell had those episodes everyone spoke about it. For a lot of people it was the first time seeing Biden looking old and sometimes lost. People age differently. Sanders and Pelosi are dynamos. Biden not so much. Are we going to do to Biden what happened to Sen Feinstein? Her decline was ignored until it became all anyone would talk about because it could be ignored no more and then she was paraded around for all to see and a lot of people wanted us to believe she was fine. Also McCain. Remember his bizarre blunders in the end? Just want to add that idt Biden is in Feinstein territory yet that shit was very sad Edited July 3 by 1pooh4u 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 3 Share Posted July 3 (edited) 31 minutes ago, naraku360 said: Yeah, but we have to be a doctor to see the walking dead from prehistory may be looking a bit like the Crypt Keeper. So, name-calling someone based on them being in a particular group that they can't change. Sounds enlightened. Edited July 3 by Belize Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 I'm all for attacking Biden, Trump or any politician, but "he's old as hell; he looks like the Crypt Keeper and will be dead soon" is problematic. I don't think I would take that any more seriously than when someone says "f*ggot" and mocks a lisp. Putting politics aside, that's how I always hear such comments and I just tune it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naraku360 Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 37 minutes ago, scoobdog said: So, you’ll vote for Harris when she replaces Biden on the ticket, right? I mean, I'll vote Biden as an anti-Trump vote. I doubt he's going to drop out, even though he never should've been running for a second term in the first place. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naraku360 Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 14 minutes ago, Belize said: So, name-calling someone based on them being in a particular group that they can't change. Sounds enlightened. You can snub your nose all day, it isn't going to change that he looks unwell and the only way you can say otherwise is either failing to have basic observational skills or pure unadulterated dishonesty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naraku360 Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 32 minutes ago, Belize said: I'm all for attacking Biden, Trump or any politician, but "he's old as hell; he looks like the Crypt Keeper and will be dead soon" is problematic. I don't think I would take that any more seriously than when someone says "f*ggot" and mocks a lisp. Putting politics aside, that's how I always hear such comments and I just tune it out. This is like calling someone ableist for being uncomfortable with their plane pilot's blindness. Maybe it's discrimination, but also maybe you should be able to see when flying a plane. He's an old guy. Everyone sees him struggling with old guy things. Those old guy things have gotten noticeably worse over the last decade. He can be old. He also needs to be able to do his job, one that happens to be among the most powerful on the planet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katt_goddess Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 3 hours ago, rpgamer said: What if best of both worlds? Biden stays in... and just keels over in October or something, and we get to say "welp, gotta postpone the election now" and we put it off and Trump is convicted of more crimes and we don't have to deal with any of this. The election wouldn't be postponed, Harris would likely be considered the nominee since she'd be acting President but you'd have so many Manchin wannabes screaming in the background that they'd muddle the message and Dumpster would likely get in from all the split vote crying on the dems side between Harris and Commander BrainWorm. Better world, Dumpster keels over/gets hit by lightening on a golf course/chokes on an uncut hotdog in October. Whoever he picks as VP is unlikely to have enough of a hold on the party in general to ensure that enough so-called republicans vote for that person for president. Further, all this blather about age. The President of the USA is literally a breath away from the best health care literally none of us here will ever experience. It kept an overweight sentient fart from dying from covid during a pandemic when said overweight sentient fart was doing everything possible to catch the plague and die. It kept 'oops, I accidentally shot my friend in the frickin' face' Cheney alive for 8 years when it felt like he was averaging a stroke every couple of months. I fairly sure it can keep an 81 year old hydrated. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobdog Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 1 hour ago, 1pooh4u said: I don’t think it’s ageist to be concerned about the mental capacity of either candidate. They are both old and only now are media outlets releasing reports from “those closest to Biden” who have had concerns about his mental health for the last year. When McConnell had those episodes everyone spoke about it. For a lot of people it was the first time seeing Biden looking old and sometimes lost. People age differently. Sanders and Pelosi are dynamos. Biden not so much. Are we going to do to Biden what happened to Sen Feinstein? Her decline was ignored until it became all anyone would talk about because it could be ignored no more and then she was paraded around for all to see and a lot of people wanted us to believe she was fine. Also McCain. Remember his bizarre blunders in the end? Just want to add that idt Biden is in Feinstein territory yet that shit was very sad We’re really only discussing the accusations that Biden has dementia or he’s senile, neither of which is the same as him not having the mental capacity to do the job. Like you said, there isn’t any evidence he’s incapacitated, but we don’t really know whether or not an 80+-y-o can handle the rigors of the most important job in the Western Hemisphere. We know he won’t abuse the job like Trump will, and we know he won’t put incompetent people in subordinate jobs like Trump will. We can’t know how he’ll react in an emergency because we haven’t had one yet. I don’t think anyone is a fan of an octogenarian being in such an important role. Feinstein was a decade older before concerns about her capacity came out, and we likely wouldn’t be scrutinizing Biden if he was just a Senator because almost all of the issues he’s displayed are related to normal age and his stutter. Because he’s expected to have the vitality and mannerisms of a man 30 years younger, he’s going to fall short. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1pooh4u Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 If everyone in the US wants to continue enjoying democracy then Trump absolutely cannot be allowed to win. Project 2025 will be an end to democracy. That’s not an exaggeration 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpgamer Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 4 hours ago, scoobdog said: You can't postpone an election. But we can definitely postpone a Supreme Court justice nomination (a lifetime position, rather than a 4 year term) because "it's too close to the election." I call bullshit. We just use the same language. "We can't nominate a new candidate, it's too close to the election." Why start following rules now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1pooh4u Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 Fuck the rules! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doom Metal Alchemist Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 10 hours ago, 1pooh4u said: Fuck the rules! Screw the rules, I have money! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsar4 Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 Remember 2020? Remember when Trump said people should inject bleach to cure Covid in front of reporters? In the week after that, Trump trailed Biden by 6.8 points in the 538 average. Now, do you remember Republicans panicking and thinking they were going to lose the election? How about Democrats? Do you remember them crowing with glee because they knew they were going to win the election? If anything, Republicans never doubted Trump would win and Democrats remained in fear that they would never defeat Trump. It's fascinating watching the ups and downs of the 2020 election and how Republicans remained delusionally confident while Democrats remained delusionally pessimistic, despite Trump being in a much biggerpolling hole than the one Biden is currently in for 2024. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpgamer Posted July 4 Share Posted July 4 While you're not wrong, I might say another factor is what comes after election. Republicans know, if they lose, they can just be obstructionist assholes and still get their way mostly, so they can feel more confident regardless. Dems know if they lose, it'll be a shitshow, so can't really afford to feel complacent. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 Broadly speaking, horserace polls aren't predictive in June-July. Also broadly speaking, reading crosstabs of polls is very misleading if you are trying to judge how subgroups have answered the questions. But some of the most famous polls are underestimating how many African-American voters there are going to be in November. The latest NY Times/Siena College and Data For Progress polls have African-Americans as 10% of their likely voter samples, when it's going to be closer to 13% (what it was in 2020). Only 10% of the electorate being African-American would be disastrously low. That percentage almost always rises every four years, so it *falling* by 3 points isn't credible. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsar4 Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 Project 2025 backfiring? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jman Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 29 minutes ago, tsar4 said: Project 2025 backfiring? It’s literally an evil plan to take away freedom. Honestly I’m more surprised members of these foundations weren’t marked for death the second the “Ban porn” part became public. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 (edited) One argument I have heard from pankicky Democratic voters as justification for their panic is that Biden has seen a long stretch of polling where he is behind Trump. Nate Silver made this argument. Putting aside the issue of whether polls are predictive, the 2024 margins are much smaller than those of 2020 and 2016. Early polls in those years had Clinton and Biden with leading margins of 6-15 points. The RCP average back in 2015 even had Clinton up 20 points. By contrast, the Trump 2024 averages of his leading margin has been at most 3.5 points. More often, it's been less than a point. *That's* the poll results Silver is so concerned about. (Yes, Silver admitted he is a Biden voter in this same forecast, and said he can now say who he supports because he no longer works for an establishment media outlet.) Edited July 5 by Belize Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1pooh4u Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 People gotta wake up. that we are even talking about Biden when the republican candidate is fuckin Trump is all we need to know. People would rather vote for the guy who is pretty much saying “I’ll dismantle democracy day 1” than Biden. There’s no spin for this and the polls are probably way off. Trump is probably ahead by a lot more. Poll accuracy is really dependent on human honesty. How many Trump voters are out there that would never admit in a poll (for whatever reason) that they’re voting for him. I bet it’s enough to fuck a poll up. “Panicky democrats” idk man maybe we should be fuckin panicking because we been here before and we’re doing the same fuckin bullshit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[classic swim] Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 “Delusionally pessimistic” and Icarus alt would be first one to leap head-on into the pit of flames. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 1 hour ago, 1pooh4u said: There’s no spin for this and the polls are probably way off. Trump is probably ahead by a lot more. Poll accuracy is really dependent on human honesty. How many Trump voters are out there that would never admit in a poll (for whatever reason) that they’re voting for him. I bet it’s enough to fuck a poll up. Maybe you would consider this good news. There's no evidence that this is a real phenomenon. "[T]here is little evidence that socially desirable (Shy Trump) responding was an important contributor to poll error." Evaluation of the 2016 Election Polls in the United States | Public Opinion Quarterly | Oxford Academic (oup.com) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 (edited) The paper linked above is very fascinating. It explains several things that many may not know: 1. The national polls in the final 13 days before the 2016 election were *not* far off from the popular vote. Forecasters like Silver just used them to come to the wrong conclusion that Clinton was going to win the electoral college. 2. Battleground state polls in the same time period *were* wrong. 3. The main reason the battleground state polls were wrong was late voting for Trump. The undecideds breaking for Trump, in other words. This "voters deciding in the final week" phenomenon doesn't favor one party more than the other. It can benefit either. Also, there is *no way* pollsters can guard against it. There just has to be a caveat that polls can swing quickly. 4. Logically following, the battleground state polls were probably right *on the days they were conducted* but not a week later. 5. The second reason the battleground states were wrong was oversampling of college educated voters, which has always been an issue for pollsters because they are more willing to take polls. It wasn't a problem in the past because the partisan preference of the education demographic was U-shaped but now has become linear. (Democrats used to do well with *both* college educated and those with no college education but that's not the case anymore.) Edited July 5 by Belize 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raptorpat Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 enough attention that it's time to distance and rely on useful idiot's plausible deniability https://apnews.com/article/trump-project-2025-biden-9d372469033d23e1e3aef5cf0470a2e6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasqueradeOverture Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 Someone get this man to draw a clock on live television Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 Anonymous source discovers what a White House Chief of Staff does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1pooh4u Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 2 hours ago, Belize said: Maybe you would consider this good news. There's no evidence that this is a real phenomenon. "[T]here is little evidence that socially desirable (Shy Trump) responding was an important contributor to poll error." Evaluation of the 2016 Election Polls in the United States | Public Opinion Quarterly | Oxford Academic (oup.com) I’m sorry but I don’t discuss politics with Jingais, which you most certainly are. It’s just not good for my mental health 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1pooh4u Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 1 hour ago, Raptorpat said: enough attention that it's time to distance and rely on useful idiot's plausible deniability https://apnews.com/article/trump-project-2025-biden-9d372469033d23e1e3aef5cf0470a2e6 Isn’t kind of late for him to be doing that considering he’s been practically quoting the shit with the poison he’s been saying? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 5 minutes ago, 1pooh4u said: I’m sorry but I don’t discuss politics with Jingais, which you most certainly are. It’s just not good for my mental health Aw c'mon. It was sourced to a scholarly journal and everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsar4 Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 Just like when someone that reported directly to him gets indicted... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katt_goddess Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 23 minutes ago, tsar4 said: Just like when someone that reported directly to him gets indicted... Serious lack of random Capitalization of Big and Important sounding words. Shenanigans declared. Someone else typed that up so he could claim he never said anything about it if pushed. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tsar4 Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 Guess who took a shower... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seight Posted July 5 Share Posted July 5 38 minutes ago, Belize said: "Hey, that's a great joke Pitchbot" *checks earpiece* "god damnit it's REAL?" 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 NY Times stupidity, international edition Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belize Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 (edited) From 2012. Edited July 6 by Belize Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasqueradeOverture Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 ABC interview not only had Biden looking/sounding like my grandfather a month before he croaked, but revealed his selfish genocidal ass for what it is. STEP DOWN MOTHERFUCKER Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1pooh4u Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sieg67 Posted July 6 Share Posted July 6 Some good news. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/ballot-drop-boxes-legal-again-in-wisconsin-after-state-supreme-court-ruling 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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