Oh, well this isn't cooked yet.

[naraku360]

8 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

All this and you can't point out what's wrong with what I just said.

Let me simplify it for you.  Overvaluing your collateral is not a crime unless the lender has been chested.

 

[1pooh4u]

Intentionally over valuing real estate in the way Trump did is a crime. He did it to defraud banks and trick them into giving him a bigger better loan 

Yes, intentionally overvaluing real estate can be a crime. This practice is often considered a form of real estate fraud or mortgage fraud, especially when it's done to deceive a financial institution or another party for personal gain. The specific charges and penalties can vary depending on the jurisdiction and the details of the case, but they are often serious.
Here's a breakdown of how it can become a crime and the potential consequences:
How it Becomes a Crime
 * Intent to Defraud: The key element is intent. Simply having a high opinion of your property's value isn't a crime. The act becomes criminal when you intentionally make false statements or misrepresentations with the goal of deceiving a lender, buyer, or other party.
 * Mortgage Fraud: A common scenario involves overvaluing a property on a loan application to secure a larger mortgage than the property is worth. This can be done by a homeowner, seller, or even an appraiser working with them.
 * Appraisal Fraud: This occurs when an appraisal is intentionally manipulated to misrepresent a property's true market value. An appraiser might work with a homeowner or other party to inflate the value, or a person might forge or alter an appraisal report themselves.
 * Bank Fraud and Wire Fraud: Because real estate transactions often involve financial institutions and interstate communications, overvaluing property for fraudulent purposes can lead to federal charges like bank fraud or wire fraud. These are very serious offenses with severe penalties.
Penalties and Consequences
The consequences for this type of fraud can be significant and may include:
 * Criminal Charges: Individuals can face felony charges at both the state and federal levels.
 * Jail or Prison Time: Convictions can result in lengthy prison sentences, sometimes for decades, depending on the amount of money involved and the specific charges.
 * Fines and Restitution: You can be ordered to pay substantial fines and to pay back any money that was fraudulently obtained (restitution).
 * Loss of Licenses: For professionals in the real estate industry, such as appraisers or brokers, a fraud conviction can lead to the loss of their professional licenses.
 * Civil Lawsuits: In addition to criminal charges, you may also face civil lawsuits from victims (e.g., lenders, buyers) to recover their financial losses.
 
*Answer generated by AI 

[Doom Metal Alchemist]

13 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

All this and you can't point out what's wrong with what I just said.

Let me simplify it for you.  Overvaluing your collateral is not a crime unless the lender has been chested.

 

You know who else is chested?

[1pooh4u]

Trump wasn’t charged criminally for his over evaluation he was charged civilly 

The case involving Donald Trump and the overvaluation of his properties was a civil, not criminal, lawsuit brought by the New York Attorney General's office. While it did not result in criminal charges, the court's findings illustrate the elements that would be necessary to establish such a crime.
The lawsuit alleged that Trump and his companies engaged in financial fraud by intentionally inflating the value of his assets on financial statements. These statements were then provided to banks and other institutions to secure more favorable loan terms and lower insurance costs. The key to the court's finding was the intent to defraud, which is a crucial element in both civil and criminal fraud cases.
Here's a breakdown of the specific acts that were found to be fraudulent:
 * Massive Overvaluations: The judge found that Trump's financial statements consistently and significantly overvalued his properties. For example, he cited instances where the value of his Mar-a-Lago estate was inflated by as much as 2,300% and a claim that his Trump Tower penthouse was nearly three times its actual size.
 * Deception to Gain Advantage: The purpose of these inflated valuations was to deceive banks and insurers. By presenting a picture of a greater net worth, Trump and his company were able to secure loans with more favorable terms and lower interest rates than they otherwise would have.
 * Rejection of Disclaimers: The defense argued that the financial statements included a disclaimer that absolved them of wrongdoing. However, the judge rejected this argument, stating that the sheer scale and persistence of the misstatements created a "fantasy world" that could not be protected by a disclaimer.
While the case was civil, the court's ruling—which found that Trump committed "persistent fraud"—shows how such actions, when done with intent to deceive and for personal financial gain, are legally considered fraudulent. The penalty imposed was a substantial financial judgment and a ban on Trump and his sons from serving as officers or directors of any New York corporation for a specified period.

 

*Answer generated by AI

[PenguinBoss]

57 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

Or, maybe he did something that isn't really a crime.

Look at his overvaluation of Mari Lago, for example.  He wanted a loan and the estate was offered as collateral.  At that point, the lender was supposed to run the due diligence in verifying the estate's value.  They didn't.  The loan was approved.

Did Don default on the loan?  Had the lender been cheated in any way?  No.  Everything was paid, as agreed and yes, the lenders did say so.  That means that no crime (fraud) had taken place in that instance.  

Me?  Well, I have a copper Zippo, new in the case with its original seal.  I could try to collatteralize it for a $280k loan.  So, if I do, it's the lender's obligation to look at what similar items had actually sold for.  ($25 to $65).  If the lender approves the loan without doing the homework, there's no fraud on my part unless I default.

Cool, now do it for the crime he was actually tried for and look even dumber.

[SwimOdin]

@The Evil Dr. Longshadowin case no one told you today, you’re a moron.

[lupin_bebop]

8 hours ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

What crime was covered up?  An NDA in a court settlement has to be approved by a judge.

……….You had a soft spot in your head for a long time as a child, didn’t you?

[naraku360]

1 minute ago, lupin_bebop said:

……….You had a soft spot in your head for a long time as a child, didn’t you?

Still does.

[The Evil Dr. Longshadow]

53 minutes ago, PenguinBoss said:

Cool, now do it for the crime he was actually tried for and look even dumber.

You're saying that none of those charges involved the alleged bank fraud?

 

1 hour ago, 1pooh4u said:

Trump wasn’t charged criminally for his over evaluation he was charged civilly 

The case involving Donald Trump and the overvaluation of his properties was a civil, not criminal, lawsuit brought by the New York Attorney General's office. While it did not result in criminal charges, the court's findings illustrate the elements that would be necessary to establish such a crime.
The lawsuit alleged that Trump and his companies engaged in financial fraud by intentionally inflating the value of his assets on financial statements. These statements were then provided to banks and other institutions to secure more favorable loan terms and lower insurance costs. The key to the court's finding was the intent to defraud, which is a crucial element in both civil and criminal fraud cases.
Here's a breakdown of the specific acts that were found to be fraudulent:
 * Massive Overvaluations: The judge found that Trump's financial statements consistently and significantly overvalued his properties. For example, he cited instances where the value of his Mar-a-Lago estate was inflated by as much as 2,300% and a claim that his Trump Tower penthouse was nearly three times its actual size.
 * Deception to Gain Advantage: The purpose of these inflated valuations was to deceive banks and insurers. By presenting a picture of a greater net worth, Trump and his company were able to secure loans with more favorable terms and lower interest rates than they otherwise would have.
 * Rejection of Disclaimers: The defense argued that the financial statements included a disclaimer that absolved them of wrongdoing. However, the judge rejected this argument, stating that the sheer scale and persistence of the misstatements created a "fantasy world" that could not be protected by a disclaimer.
While the case was civil, the court's ruling—which found that Trump committed "persistent fraud"—shows how such actions, when done with intent to deceive and for personal financial gain, are legally considered fraudulent. The penalty imposed was a substantial financial judgment and a ban on Trump and his sons from serving as officers or directors of any New York corporation for a specified period.

 

*Answer generated by AI

All of this is nonsense, because none of the lenders have been cheated out of anything and burden of veriying the collateral's value STILL stays on the lender.

Ai is only going to show whatever is programmed into it.

Edited Thursday at 10:12 PM by The Evil Dr. Longshadow

[The Evil Dr. Longshadow]

1 hour ago, naraku360 said:

Did the lender get paid as agreed or not?

[naraku360]

1 minute ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

Did the lender get paid as agreed or not?

Your response had nothing to do with my post.

[lupin_bebop]

4 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

Did the lender get paid as agreed or not?

No. 

[The Evil Dr. Longshadow]

1 minute ago, lupin_bebop said:

No. 

Show me the lender who wasn't paid in that case.  Yes, THAT case, NOT a motley collection of rumors about other cases that never made it into a New York courtroom.

[The Evil Dr. Longshadow]

6 minutes ago, naraku360 said:

Your response had nothing to do with my post.

You posted a gif without a comment.

[1pooh4u]

21 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

You're saying that none of those charges involved the alleged bank fraud?

 

All of this is nonsense, because none of the lenders have been cheated out of anything and burden of veriying the collateral's value STILL stays on the lender.

Ai is only going to show whatever is programmed into it.

He cheated the bank out of $$ because he should not have gotten such favorable terms on his loans

And he has defaulted on about 640 million in loans 

meanwhile your bray like a jackass about college loan forgiveness because you’re an absolute moron who like licking elite boots

[1pooh4u]

AI also learns by:

As a large language model, I was not built to "learn" in the same way a human does. My knowledge and abilities come from a process called training.
Here's a breakdown of how I get my information and learn to answer questions:
 * Massive Training Data: I was trained on a colossal dataset of text and code from the internet, including books, articles, websites, and more. This data allows me to understand and generate human language, and to identify patterns and relationships between different concepts.
 * Multimodality: A key aspect of my design is that I am multimodal. This means I was pre-trained to understand and reason across different types of information, including text, images, audio, and video. This allows me to analyze a wide variety of inputs and provide more comprehensive answers.
 * Transformer Architecture and Mixture of Experts (MoE): I use a neural network architecture called a transformer model, which is highly effective at processing sequential data like text. In addition, I use a "Mixture of Experts" (MoE) architecture, which splits the model into smaller "expert" networks. Each of these experts specializes in a specific domain or data type. The model learns to selectively activate the most relevant experts based on the input I receive, making me more efficient and accurate.
 * Continuous Improvement: My creators at Google are constantly working to improve me. This involves refining the training process, expanding the data I'm trained on, and developing new techniques to enhance my capabilities. For example, my models are designed to reason through their thoughts before responding, which leads to more accurate and reliable outputs.
 * Real-time Information: To provide up-to-date answers, I can also access and process real-time information from Google Search. This allows me to answer questions about current events or other topics that have emerged since my initial training.
In short, I'm not learning in a human sense, but rather using a sophisticated system to process vast amounts of information, identify patterns, and generate responses based on the data I was trained on and what I can access in real-time.
 

 

[1pooh4u]

Not my fault you’re an idiot who refuses to learn anything not coming out your own ass 

[naraku360]

37 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

You posted a gif without a comment.

Wasn't a gif.

[The Evil Dr. Longshadow]

51 minutes ago, 1pooh4u said:

He cheated the bank out of $$ because he should not have gotten such favorable terms on his loans

And he has defaulted on about 640 million in loans 

meanwhile your bray like a jackass about college loan forgiveness because you’re an absolute moron who like licking elite boots

There are unfounded rumors that he cheated a few lenders.  Stay on the actual case in the New York court.  I don't care about any rumors outside of that.

The lenders made their decisions on the loans without doing their homework.  Again, verifying the value of collateral offered is the burden of the lender, not the borrower.  If Don received more favorable terms than whatever YOU think he should have gotten, just look at the shoddy work of the lenders.

Edited Thursday at 11:24 PM by The Evil Dr. Longshadow

[The Evil Dr. Longshadow]

13 minutes ago, naraku360 said:

Wasn't a gif.

You didn't post this?  Your name is on it.

[PenguinBoss]

1 hour ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

You're saying that none of those charges involved the alleged bank fraud?

 

I'm saying YOU'RE the one that claimed civil suits are illegitimate. And I don't know why you're even bringing it up when I was talking about the criminal case.

You can just admit you have no idea what I'm talking about instead of talking out of your ass and hoping for the best.

[The Evil Dr. Longshadow]

2 minutes ago, PenguinBoss said:

I'm saying YOU'RE the one that claimed civil suits are illegitimate. And I don't know why you're even bringing it up when I was talking about the criminal case.

You can just admit you have no idea what I'm talking about instead of talking out of your ass and hoping for the best.

What are the criminal charges?

[PenguinBoss]

6 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

What are the criminal charges?

Falsifying business records.

And before you ask another question, because this is apparently the first time you've heard of it, educate yourself. I'm not bending over backwards to explain it to you just so you can say he was railroaded again.

[1pooh4u]

31 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

There are unfounded rumors that he cheated a few lenders.  Stay on the actual case in the New York court.  I don't care about any rumors outside of that.

The lenders made their decisions on the loans without doing their homework.  Again, verifying the value of collateral offered is the burden of the lender, not the borrower.  If Don received more favorable terms than whatever YOU think he should have gotten, just look at the shoddy work of the lenders.

THAT WAS A PART OF THE CIVIL CASE IN NY WTF ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?!?!

[naraku360]

21 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

You didn't post this?  Your name is on it.

That's a different post.

😐

[katt_goddess]

3 hours ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

All this and you can't point out what's wrong with what I just said.

Let me simplify it for you.  Overvaluing your collateral is not a crime unless the lender has been chested.

 

Overvaluing it for an over the top loan and then undervaluing it to escape paying taxes and/or get a massive tax write-off/refund is fraud. 

Which he has done several times with all his properties and which is now coming back to haunt his 'I can't release my taxes as president because they are being audited for the next 8-10 years.'

[The Evil Dr. Longshadow]

1 hour ago, PenguinBoss said:

Falsifying business records.

And before you ask another question, because this is apparently the first time you've heard of it, educate yourself. I'm not bending over backwards to explain it to you just so you can say he was railroaded again.

Yeah, fine... just as long as all that shit gets sent to the dumpster by a judge who really knows what he's looking at and actually cares about how the law might apply to it.  In short, it could be a real judge instead of a hand picked holy inquisitor.

 

.

[katt_goddess]

Just now, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

Yeah, fine... just as long as all that shit gets sent to the dumpster by a judge who really knows what he's looking at and actually cares about how the law might apply to it.  In short, it could be a real judge instead of a hand picked holy inquisitor.

 

.

If it was a hand-picked holy inquisitor the first time, we wouldn't be having this particular discussion because Princess Tinyhands would be ketchupping out in an iron maiden somewhere, never to be heard of again. 

[naraku360]

10 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

Yeah, fine... just as long as all that shit gets sent to the dumpster by a judge who really knows what he's looking at and actually cares about how the law might apply to it.  In short, it could be a real judge instead of a hand picked holy inquisitor.

 

.

So, if the judge rules in a way you don't like, you will automatically assume it's invalid.

That's stupid.

[PenguinBoss]

23 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

Yeah, fine... just as long as all that shit gets sent to the dumpster by a judge who really knows what he's looking at and actually cares about how the law might apply to it.  In short, it could be a real judge instead of a hand picked holy inquisitor.

 

.

Uh huh, as expected. It doesn't matter if it's civil or criminal, you always find a way that what he did isn't against the law. 

The entire point of this is you claiming you would accept human trafficking charges if there was proof, but you've shown it doesn't really matter if the evidence is there or not. It's time to stop lying and admit it.

[lupin_bebop]

4 hours ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

Show me the lender who wasn't paid in that case.  Yes, THAT case, NOT a motley collection of rumors about other cases that never made it into a New York courtroom.

………..You can’t be this stupid. That’s literally the fraud case(s). Talking to you is like talking to my mom. You can’t even keep your OWN bullshit straight……and it’s BULLSHIT. How do you fuck your OWN bullshit up?

[Top Gun]

He really is the most pathetic cumstain currently walking the face of the earth.

[lupin_bebop]

3 hours ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

Yeah, fine... just as long as all that shit gets sent to the dumpster by a judge who really knows what he's looking at and actually cares about how the law might apply to it.  In short, it could be a real judge instead of a hand picked holy inquisitor.

 

.

Wait……lemme get this right…..you want a judge to throw out something because they have to…...(checks notes)….. apply LAWS? The VERY JOB THEY DO DAILY?

 

The fuck?

Edited 20 hours ago by lupin_bebop

[The Evil Dr. Longshadow]

7 minutes ago, lupin_bebop said:

Wait……lemme get this right…..you want a judge to throw out something because they have to…...(checks notes)….. apply LAWS? The VERY JOB THEY DO DAILY?

 

The fuck?

Some judges only apply the law when it happens to be convenient, because they're too busy pushing a personal, political or social agenda.

For example, a judge who suffers from chronic Trump Derangement Syndrome should not be put in charge of any case sgainst Trump.

Edited 19 hours ago by The Evil Dr. Longshadow

[lupin_bebop]

8 minutes ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

Some judges only apply the law when it happens to be convenient, because they're too busy pushing a personal, political or social agenda.

For example, a judge who suffers from chronic Trump Derangement Syndrome should not be put in charge of any case sgainst Trump.

………So….the greater percentage of the Supreme Court and most of the judges on most of his cases? Got it.

Also…..How DARE you make sense. You’re a fucking idiot……How are you able to make a correct ass statement? Am I having a stroke? 

The actual fuck?

[naraku360]

37 minutes ago, Top Gun said:

He really is the most pathetic cumstain currently walking the face of the earth.

Hey, Packard is NOT my sister!

[scoobdog]

7 hours ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

Show me the lender who wasn't paid in that case.  Yes, THAT case, NOT a motley collection of rumors about other cases that never made it into a New York courtroom.

Can I show you another borrower at the same bank who didn’t get a loan because Donald Trump fraudulently qualified for a loan he should not have been eligible for?  Are you saying the bank is always the only possible victim of bank fraud?

[The Evil Dr. Longshadow]

4 hours ago, scoobdog said:

Can I show you another borrower at the same bank who didn’t get a loan because Donald Trump fraudulently qualified for a loan he should not have been eligible for?  Are you saying the bank is always the only possible victim of bank fraud?

No.  That's the bank's problem for not maintaining adequate capital.

[1pooh4u]

[scoobdog]

5 hours ago, The Evil Dr. Longshadow said:

No.  That's the bank's problem for not maintaining adequate capital.

It is not the bank’s problem under the law.  Fraud has nothing to do with whether or not a bank can cover it.