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The Toonami Ratings Thread 1.0 :You are on a new board


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11:30 PM Dragon Ball Super 1,236,000 (86.19%)

12:00 AM DBZ Kai: The Final Chapters 1,210,000 (97.90%)

12:30 AM JoJo's Bizarre Adventure 915,000 (75.62%)

1:00 AM Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn 819,000 (89.51%)

1:30 AM Hunter × Hunter 685,000 (83.64%)

2:00 AM Naruto: Shippuden 654,000 (95.47%)

2:30 AM One Piece 584,000 (89.30%)

 

So here's the question: Is the drop from DBZ Kai to JoJo due to JoJo being the follow up, or is it due to DBZ Kai being the lead in?  I don't really want to suggest it, but it might be worth it to move JoJo down and put another show at 12:30 to see if it retains from DBZ Kai any better.  Other for JoJo, the retention rates look pretty good this week.  Even One Piece had close to 90% retention.

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So here's the question: Is the drop from DBZ Kai to JoJo due to JoJo being the follow up, or is it due to DBZ Kai being the lead in?  I don't really want to suggest it, but it might be worth it to move JoJo down and put another show at 12:30 to see if it retains from DBZ Kai any better.  Other for JoJo, the retention rates look pretty good this week.  Even One Piece had close to 90% retention.

 

I think I know what the problem is...

 

The loss of Bleach. Bleach fans usually tend to at least be casual anime fans, so that audience would easily bleed into the subsequent shows. However, once Kai got situated for a few months and all the Bleach fans left, the retention started to become god awful as a good chunk of normie DBZ viewers are only in it for DBZ and dip.

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ADULTS 18-49 RETENTION

8:00 PM Dragon Ball Super 0.361 462802 (120.33%)

8:30 PM Samurai Jack 0.249 319218 (68.98%)

 

11:30 PM Dragon Ball Super 744,000 (85.67%) 0.580

12:00 AM DBZ Kai: The Final Chapters 736,000 (98.92%) 0.574

12:30 AM JoJo's Bizarre Adventure 563,000 (76.49%) 0.439

1:00 AM Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn 489,000 (86.86%) 0.381

1:30 AM Hunter × Hunter 410,000 (83.84%) 0.320

2:00 AM Naruto: Shippuden 406,000 (99.02%) 0.317

2:30 AM One Piece 384,000 (94.58%) 0.300

3:00 AM One-Punch Man 417,000 (108.59%) 0.325

ADULTS 18-49 TOONAMI AVERAGE - 518,625

 

Hey guys, let's look at the bright side: Toonami is trending UP. And as long as it's trending up, I'm happy...

 

CURRENT SHOW AVERAGES

Total Viewers

Dragon Ball Super (8 PM) - 1,036,500 (2 episodes)

Samurai Jack Rerun (8:30 PM) - 768,000 (1 episode)

Dragon Ball Super (11:30 PM) - 1,302,500 (2 episodes)

Dragon Ball Z Kai: Final Chapters - 1,167,000 (2 episodes)

Jojo's Bizarre Adventure - 985,917 (12 episodes)

Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn - 783,000 (2 episodes)

Hunter × Hunter - 888,941 (24 episodes)

Naruto: Shippuden - 884,626 (141 episodes)

One Piece - 798,704 (168 episodes)

One Punch Man Rerun - 633,300 (10 episodes)

 

Adults 18-49

Dragon Ball Super (8 PM, Estimate) - 487,500 (2 episodes)

Samurai Jack Rerun (8:30, Estimate) - 319,000 (1 episode)

Dragon Ball Super (11:30 PM) - 789,500 (2 episodes)

Dragon Ball Z Kai: Final Chapters - 688,500 (2 episodes)

Jojo's Bizarre Adventure - 599,167 (12 episodes)

Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn - 471,000 (2 episodes)

Hunter × Hunter - 523,882 (24 episodes)

Naruto: Shippuden - 488,973 (141 episodes)

One Piece - 434,427 (168 episodes)

One Punch Man Rerun - 386,700 (10 episodes)

 

Adults 18-34 (Estimated)

Dragon Ball Super (8 PM) - 323,000 (2 episodes)

Dragon Ball Z Kai: Final Chapters - 475,500 (2 episodes)

Jojo's Bizarre Adventure - 399,333 (12 episodes)

Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn - 322,500 (2 episodes)

 

Well, Gundam still sticks out like a sore thumb in the aggregate averages, but not as badly. Hopefully it continues to improve!

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I think I know what the problem is...

 

The loss of Bleach. Bleach fans usually tend to at least be casual anime fans, so that audience would easily bleed into the subsequent shows. However, once Kai got situated for a few months and all the Bleach fans left, the retention started to become god awful as a good chunk of normie DBZ viewers are only in it for DBZ and dip.

 

That sounds about right.

 

The retention from the anchor to the next show was arguably better when Bleach premieres were holding down the fort, especially when Naruto followed it. There's plenty of cross-over in those two fan bases. Generally speaking no matter how good the line-up is, there's usually a decent drop after DBZ  and One-Punch Man was really the only exception thus far. Once that drop happens things tend to level off some and there's a gradual decline rather than very sharp drops. But all the little drops add up.

 

Add to that, all of Adult Swim being down (and all of cable being down) and probably nothing short of DBZ, OPM or Titan will regularly break 0.6 18-49 at 11:30 or midnight though I have high hopes for Samurai Jack premieres. Starting at 0.6, a drop to 0.4 is inevitable and dropping into the 0.3 range by 2AM is more than likely going to happen. And teenagers and younger will drop off sharply before 1am, diminishing the chances of any show that late cracking 1 million but that's largely true of the other nights of Adult Swim at this point. Toonami's retention between shows looks rather good by comparison and DBZ's retention of Family Guy is usually exceptional.

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Imagine Turner fires DeMarco because his ads aren't working...

 

OH BOY.

 

Toonami would be dead very shortly thereafter.

 

Adult Swim would probably just hang on to Dragon Ball Super, DBZ Kai, and a handful of other anime and stop picking up more (except new seasons of AoT and OPM). Not make any more co-productions and drop action down to 2 to 3 hours a week.

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Toonami would be dead very shortly thereafter.

 

Adult Swim would probably just hang on to Dragon Ball Super, DBZ Kai, and a handful of other anime and stop picking up more (except new seasons of AoT and OPM). Not make any more co-productions and drop action down to 2 to 3 hours a week.

 

I don't think there's much danger of any of that crap happening anytime soon. We're gonna get Jack and FLCL 2/3. The thing is, Super is doubled and DBZ Kai FC is so slice-of-life right now that it's just not doing as well as it did before, and other shows further down the lineup get stung a bit. But when we get to the meat of DBZ Kai FC with Babidi and Buu, I'm sure things will pick up a lot!

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Toonami would be dead very shortly thereafter.

 

Adult Swim would probably just hang on to Dragon Ball Super, DBZ Kai, and a handful of other anime and stop picking up more (except new seasons of AoT and OPM). Not make any more co-productions and drop action down to 2 to 3 hours a week.

 

In a world where Mr. Robot can lose more than a million viewers from Suits and not be cancelled, I think Toonami (and DeMarco's job) is perfectly fine.

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We've seen time and time again where Toonami shows can buck major trends and dominate Twitter and other social media while they're running, and this week was no exception:

 

http://toonamifaithful.com/toonami-trending-rundown-for-january-21-22-2017/

 

United States Trends:#JoJosBizarreAdventure [#2]

#GundamUnicorn [#3]

#HunterXHunter [#1]

#Shippuden [#5]

#OnePiece [#1]

Kuma (From One Piece) [#16]

Zoro (From One Piece) [#4]

Toonami/#Toonami [#3]

#DragonBallSuper (Also during the Primetime Presentation) [#2]

#SamuraiJack (During the Primetime Presentation and during the announcement the next day) [#7]

#DBZKai [#3]

 

#OnePunchMan [#2]

Tweet Counts:

Toonami [6,629 tweets]

#Toonami [2,574 tweets]

#DragonBallSuper [15.9k tweets]

#DBZKai [1,736 tweets]

#JoJosBizarreAdventure [2,249 tweets]

#GundamUnicorn [1,321 tweets]

#HunterXHunter [2,137 tweets]

Kuma (From One Piece) [32.8k tweets]

 

Well, that's the good news. Unfortunately, we've also seen how nights in which trending was high also doesn't necessarily translate into high ratings. Well, last Saturday night this was also true, and brace yourselves, because this is just plain depressing:

 

http://www.showbuzzdaily.com/articles/showbuzzdailys-top-150-saturday-cable-originals-network-finals-1-21-2017.html

 

Final-Cable-2017-Jan-21.SAT_.png

 

1/21/2017 Dragon Ball Super (8 PM) - #58

Adults 18-34 Rating - N/A

Estimated 18-34 - #VALUE! ( #VALUE! )

Adults 18-49 Rating - 0.28

Estimated 18-49 - 359,000 ( 51.29% )

Total Viewers - 700,000

 

1/21/2017 DBZ Kai: Final Chapters - #20

Adults 18-34 Rating - 0.53

Estimated 18-34 - 360,000 ( 38.92% )

Adults 18-49 Rating - 0.43

Estimated 18-49 - 551,000 ( 59.57% )

Total Viewers - 925,000

 

1/21/2017 JoJo's Bizarre Adventure - #36

Adults 18-34 Rating - 0.41

Estimated 18-34 - 279,000 ( 36.71% )

Adults 18-49 Rating - 0.34

Estimated 18-49 - 436,000 ( 57.37% )

Total Viewers - 760,000

 

1/21/2017 Gundam Unicorn - #50

Adults 18-34 Rating - 0.38

Estimated 18-34 - 258,000 ( 39.81% )

Adults 18-49 Rating - 0.30

Estimated 18-49 - 385,000 ( 59.41% )

Total Viewers - 648,000

 

I'm--just at a loss for words here. The 8 PM DB Super episode failed to crack the Top 50, and as such we may never know its performance with Adults 18-34. Samurai Jack reruns at 8:30 followed later by R&M may have been more of a failure than One Piece, as Toonami ALWAYS recovered from that valley in 2015, but now that's not the case. Perhaps more importantly, having Super at 8 PM has now officially effectively divided its audience, to Toonami's complete and utter detriment. However, the blame does also go to the news, with cable news channels which usually don't even challenge Toonami's dominance grabbing 15 of the top 20 slots with 18-49 in cable originals as the Trump Inauguration just completely turned everything upside-down.

 

I provided the Trending numbers on this post to make the case that if nothing changes and Super remains with premieres at 8 PM, with Jack after at 8:30, it may signal that Nielsen Ratings are losing their ground as the medium which signals a show's wellbeing to advertisers, as trending and social media takes over. And there is also the good news, a silver lining on this dark cloud, in that DBZKFC managed to win the night in Adults 18-34 among cable originals (with Super's rerun at 11:30 probably only doing better, but it was disqualified since it was a rerun), and JoJo effectively tied for #4 and Gundam got #7 in that demographic at least among the Top 50 cable originals for 18-49, so advertisers will probably still look at that as a win despite that ridiculous amount of qualifiers. More good news? It can only go up from here next week, right?

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You shouldn't. I just enjoy the shows, not worry about how they'll do in the ratings like all the other people on here do.

 

But even so, I have to wonder: are these the worst ratings the block has gotten thus far?

 

No, but they are the worst ratings for a non-marathon block in 2 years, at least from what I can see so far. The night of 1/10/15 was worse, when, lo and behold, the block was ALSO led-off by a rerun! Though those AOT episodes were 3-peats and not near-premieres like what we have right now.

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Proof that Tooonami viewership is completely situational and only hits big when the mainstream shows in front of it hit big, suggesting that no.... there isn't really a substantial audience for Toonami and it just gets lucky due to Family Guy and nothing else being on at the time. And even then that doesn't always work.

 

I guess the ultimate test would be to let Toonami carry itself instead of piggy-backing from the ratings FG gives it, but we all know it'd fail.

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You shouldn't. I just enjoy the shows, not worry about how they'll do in the ratings like all the other people on here do.

 

But even so, I have to wonder: are these the worst ratings the block has gotten thus far?

 

I just think it's more right to care about the fate of the world (regardless of what it currently is) than numbers for a television block.

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Or maybe we should dismiss these as "alternative facts?" Good lord, that oxymoron makes me scratch my head!

 

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/daily-ratings/saturday-cable-ratings-jan-21-2017/

 

Well, 11:30 Super lost bad from 11 PM Family Guy, but not THAT bad, since FG couldn't even crack 1.4 million. From there drops as normal.

 

11:30 PM Dragon Ball Super 1,041,000 (74.95%)

12:00 AM DBZ Kai: The Final Chapters 925,000 (88.86%)

12:30 AM JoJo's Bizarre Adventure 760,000 (82.16%)

1:00 AM Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn 648,000 (85.26%)

 

And that's all I have since, as you can see, Gundam didn't even make the Top 100, nor did Super at 8 PM nor Jack or anything else after Gundam. But hopefully Programming Insider/Son Of The Bronx will provide the whole story soon!

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Do you have to be so goddamn pessimistic whenever the ratings are lower than usual?

 

[furthermore, why am i giving a shit?]

 

I ain't being pessimistic. I'm laughing my ass off. Japan this ain't. Just give the masses their reality tv shows and sports.

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Especially One Piece.  Betcha that didn't crack 300k total.  >:D

 

Not much you can do when the whole block preformed like shit. Toonami is too reliant on the show before it to succeed. It needs a show like The Walking Dead or Big Bang Theory. Something that could score them big ratings even during down weeks.

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Not much you can do when the whole block preformed like shit. Toonami is too reliant on the show before it to succeed. It needs a show like The Walking Dead or Big Bang Theory. Something that could score them big ratings even during down weeks.

 

Except anime can't do that. Ever.

 

Family Guy is beginning to wear its welcome to the general public.

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http://programminginsider.com/ratings/final-nationals/saturday-final-nationals-mixed-results-nba-saturday-primetime-season-premiere-abc/

 

11:30  Dragon Ball Super - 1041

12:00  Dragon Ball Z Kai: The Final Chapters - 925

12:30  JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure - 760

1:00  Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn - 648

1:30  Hunter X Hunter - 618

2:00  Naruto: Shippuden - 520

2:30  One Piece - 450

3:00  One Punch Man - 498

 

 

So how long before Turner scraps [AS], cancels anime, makes CN 24/7, and moves Rick & Morty to TBS?

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Well, here's the full retention numbers...

 

http://programminginsider.com/ratings/final-nationals/saturday-final-nationals-mixed-results-nba-saturday-primetime-season-premiere-abc/

 

TOTAL VIEWERS

8:00 PM Dragon Ball Super 700,000

8:30 PM Samurai Jack 551,000 (78.71%)

 

11:30 PM Dragon Ball Super 1,041,000 (74.95%)

12:00 AM DBZ Kai: The Final Chapters 925,000 (88.86%)

12:30 AM JoJo's Bizarre Adventure 760,000 (82.16%)

1:00 AM Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn 648,000 (85.26%)

1:30 AM Hunter × Hunter 618,000 (95.37%)

2:00 AM Naruto: Shippuden 520,000 (84.14%)

2:30 AM One Piece 450,000 (86.54%)

3:00 AM One-Punch Man 498,000 (110.67%)

TOTAL VIEWERS TOONAMI AVERAGE - 682,500

 

ADULTS 18-49 RETENTION

 

8:00 PM Dragon Ball Super 0.276 353,832

8:30 PM Samurai Jack 0.199 255,118 (72.10%)

 

11:30 PM Dragon Ball Super 588,000 (67.65%) 0.458

12:00 AM DBZ Kai: The Final Chapters 550,000 (93.54%) 0.429

12:30 AM JoJo's Bizarre Adventure 437,000 (79.45%) 0.341

1:00 AM Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn 386,000 (88.33%) 0.301

1:30 AM Hunter × Hunter 369,000 (95.60%) 0.287

2:00 AM Naruto: Shippuden 313,000 (84.82%) 0.244

2:30 AM One Piece 274,000 (87.54%) 0.214

3:00 AM One-Punch Man 310,000 (113.14%) 0.242

ADULTS 18-49 TOONAMI AVERAGE - 403,375 0.315

 

CURRENT SHOW AVERAGES

Total Viewers

Dragon Ball Super (8 PM) - 924,333 (3 episodes)

Samurai Jack Rerun (8:30 PM) - 659,500 (2 episodes)

Dragon Ball Super (11:30 PM) - 1,215,333 (3 episodes)

Dragon Ball Z Kai: Final Chapters - 1,086,333 (3 episodes)

Jojo's Bizarre Adventure - 968,538 (13 episodes)

Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn - 738,000 (3 episodes)

Hunter × Hunter - 881,200 (34 episodes)

Naruto: Shippuden - 882,059 (142 episodes)

One Piece - 796,653 (169 episodes)

One Punch Man Rerun - 621,000 (11 episodes)

 

Adults 18-49

Dragon Ball Super (8 PM, Estimate) - 443,000 (3 episodes)

Samurai Jack Rerun (8:30, Estimate) - 287,000 (2 episodes)

Dragon Ball Super (11:30 PM) - 722,333 (3 episodes)

Dragon Ball Z Kai: Final Chapters - 642,333 (3 episodes)

Jojo's Bizarre Adventure - 586,692 (13 episodes)

Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn - 442,667 (3 episodes)

Hunter × Hunter - 519,457 (34 episodes)

Naruto: Shippuden - 487,565 (125 episodes)

One Piece - 433,144 (125 episodes)

One Punch Man Rerun - 351,545 (11 episodes)

 

Adults 18-34 (Estimated)

Dragon Ball Super (8 PM) - 323,000 (2 episodes)

Dragon Ball Z Kai: Final Chapters - 437,000 (3 episodes)

Jojo's Bizarre Adventure - 390,077 (13 episodes)

Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn - 301,000 (3 episodes)

 

Note no change to 8 PM DBS in 18-34 since it failed to make the top 50 for 18-49.

 

Turn the page...

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Hi

 

While the ratings were pretty low this week, there's nothing to panic about yet. The 2017 line-up had a solid first week, and the second week it out-averaged the rest of the Adult Swim line-up in the 18-49 demo. Nothing is going to change after one night of low ratings, where even Family Guy couldn't break 1.4 million and a 0.6 in the key demo.

 

With the news that Samurai Jack is coming back in March at 11:30, it looks like they've got plans to expand Toonami. The expected move is to move DBS to 11:00, put Jack at 11:30, and leave the rest of the line-up. They may also be airing Jack at 8:30 because they're planning to put encores there.

 

Now, if the low ratings continue and Toonami consistently does worse than the rest of Adult Swim, then I could see plans changing with DBS and everything else getting bumped back, but this one week of bad ratings all around isn't going to cause that change.

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I believe one easy fix would be replacing 8 PM premieres of Dragon Ball Super with encores of the previous week's 11:30 Toonami showing. If you ask me, if the 8 PM hour isn't branded part of Toonami, then Toonami should get those premieres. It would be as simple as showing the same episode at 8 PM 2 weeks in a row. I daresay if Super had 11:30 PM premieres instead of encores of the 8 PM premiere, it would have gotten like 1.4M and even beaten Family Guy at 11 PM on those week weaks. Keep in mind that the DBZ Kai episode which scored 2.015M in August 2015 also had an 8 PM encore the following week, so encores at 8 PM have proven not to be too detrimental to Dragon Ball franchise premieres during Toonami.

 

In the meantime, a lot of DB Super's success at 8 PM is in which movie CN decides to end their programming day with at 6 PM as a lead-in. The first couple of weeks, fairly well-received movies led into Super and were able to grant it that 1M+ windfall. Last week it was the absolutely-deplorable Spy Kids 2. This week, it's the slightly more beloved Rio. We'll just have to see how this does...

 

Also, the last two weeks, it's been more recent episodes of Family Guy which led into Toonami, from 2014 or 2015. This week, FG goes back to the beginning, with the first two episodes from 1999 leading-in to Toonami. This should be an interesting test of the timelessness of those episodes!

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