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The Toonami Ratings Thread 1.0 :You are on a new board


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Just now, Sketch said:

Turner networks got the NBA Play-Offs and there was a game last Monday (I think) which had 14 million viewers. During that game, an FLCL promo aired. Clearly it didn't do much good and likely cost more than the billboards because that's mad valuable ad space.

i didn't think that cost anything

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3 minutes ago, Daos said:

It's a million dollars a minute. Unless they had absolutely no other buyers for the spots that's what it cost them.

it costs them money to advertise on a turner network?

Edited by korosu
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26 minutes ago, korosu said:

it costs them money to advertise on a turner network?

It costs Turner Network a million dollars a minute to advertise their own shows rather than sell that ad space to an actual buyer.

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There’s that disconnect on FLCL.

The thing is, it’s the delivery method.  Netflix making freaking Devilman a hit in the US is a small miracle when you think about it, but odds are very good it doesn’t happen if delivered via conventional TV.

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5 hours ago, Sketch said:

It was me. I'm the Sketch on Toonami Faithful and Sketch1984 on Twitter. It was a bit savage, sorry. xD

FLCL Progressive didn't do so bad by the current standards, arguably it did well. It's doing great on iTunes and it had strong demos. Hard to ignore it not even getting 600,000 total viewers but the demos matter way more and it's not really it's fault. The schedule screwed it over. FLCL held MHA great but before that DBZ lost big from DBS and MHA lost even more from DBZ. They didn't plan this well in the end. If you put a world premiere behind two glorified reruns, you can't expect much. So I hope they're satisfied.

Daos, they really don't know MHA is on Toonami? Huh. It does get promos every week. Where do you think it could be advertised where they would have noticed it?

To be fair, they said MHA was unexpected, so they had to put it somewhere, but it happened to be just a few episodes before their own darling show also premiered, making it very awkward.

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9 hours ago, Jman said:

There’s that disconnect on FLCL.

The thing is, it’s the delivery method.  Netflix making freaking Devilman a hit in the US is a small miracle when you think about it, but odds are very good it doesn’t happen if delivered via conventional TV.

Honestly, I don't think people will be talking about Devil Man Crybaby for much longer but it probably would have gone over about as well as Space Dandy if it aired on Toonami (obviously not as it is because dang they can't show that uncensored). And more to the point, people are only talking about Devilman and Aggretsuko and the other Netflix original anime didn't create much buzz, including that Godzilla movie.

FLCL Progressive going straight to Netflix probably would have done well by name alone if it got on the front page but would be forgotten even faster.

It clearly has made some waves given it's keeping up with new episodes of Family Guy and Archer on iTunes and currently the #3 show in animation. Which goes to show there are other was of Toonami getting their money's worth from an original but it also speaks to the fact that (as we all know) television isn't what it used to be and while linear TV is far from dead the "watch anywhere" method is definitely on the rise. Turner seems intent to ride that train even if Adult Swim will continue to focus primarily on the linear broadcast.

Edited by Sketch
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9 hours ago, elfie said:

To be fair, they said MHA was unexpected, so they had to put it somewhere, but it happened to be just a few episodes before their own darling show also premiered, making it very awkward.

And I'm sure they expected good things from it. The timing was bad. Waiting until DBZ Kai or JoJo ended would have been better but if they needed to shuffle for MHA I think they should have kept FLCL at 11:30 and put MHA at midnight. I realize that would tick off some people but it was only 3 weeks before FLCL Progressive. Otherwise, they could have moved MHA to midnight last Saturday and used the marathon week as a buffer for the change-over. Maybe FLCL wouldn't have done any better after DBZ Kai but the new season should have at least been given that chance.

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12 hours ago, Daos said:

It costs Turner Network a million dollars a minute to advertise their own shows rather than sell that ad space to an actual buyer.

I think if it's on the same network it doesn't cost anything but it is foregoing valuable ad-space.

For Adult Swim to promote a show on a different Turner network during a huge sporting event, that would cost a lot of marketing money. You might chock that up to lack of synergy at Time Warner and Turner but I suspect that's how it goes.

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18 hours ago, Sketch said:

I think if it's on the same network it doesn't cost anything but it is foregoing valuable ad-space.

For Adult Swim to promote a show on a different Turner network during a huge sporting event, that would cost a lot of marketing money. You might chock that up to lack of synergy at Time Warner and Turner but I suspect that's how it goes.

In other words, basically it's an opportunity cost: you could choose to make that money by selling the ad space or you could choose to promote one of your internal projects and NOT make that money. Now the question is: is 580K people watching an episode of FLCL worth 1M? It was rather expensive at $1.72 a head, but maybe the comparison between what that slot HAD gotten at Midnight so far in 2018 in 18-49 vs. what it got last week is more germane. That would be 317K vs. 372K, a gain of only 55K. And $1M/55K = $18.18. So that's how much in ad dollars that the episode of FLCL would have to have recouped to pay for the ad space during Game 7 of the NBA Finals. Had it aired twice, that number would double to $36.36, at least in theory. But then again, the full impact of FLCL hasn't yet been realized so this math might not be all that reliable.

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Well, would Turner rather have 500k for 30 seconds or the trivial amount of viewership the ads helped garner?

Assuming of course that they didn't just have free space, pauses in sports events can be unpredictable and lead to extra ad space. So maybe they just slipped in ads for Turner affiliated shows when they had the opportunity? In that case no harm in trying.

I think we can all agree that any money spent advertising a show you're showing 4th on Toonami is probably a waste of money.

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Yeah, sadly you're right. As opposed to where it should be in the lineup, 2nd right ahead of Super, it was a waste of money.

But it IS also possible there was extra ad space due to extra breaks--but could they have made such a move on-the-fly to promote an [as] show, and a Toonami show at that?

I guess the answer is "maybe!"

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We've always seemed to want Toonami to do a little more advertising outside of its parent network, but when an FLCL Progressive ad airs during an extremely-hyped NBA playoff game and fails to make a dent, that's a pretty big argument against this.

They definitely should have aired it in an earlier slot. I'm not sure how you go to this from an 11:00 premiere for Samurai Jack S5. I think swapping it with DBZ Kai, although unfair to the latter show, would've been a better look, since it allows you to easily replace it with a more typical premiere.

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6 hours ago, Blatch said:

We've always seemed to want Toonami to do a little more advertising outside of its parent network, but when an FLCL Progressive ad airs during an extremely-hyped NBA playoff game and fails to make a dent, that's a pretty big argument against this.

They definitely should have aired it in an earlier slot. I'm not sure how you go to this from an 11:00 premiere for Samurai Jack S5. I think swapping it with DBZ Kai, although unfair to the latter show, would've been a better look, since it allows you to easily replace it with a more typical premiere.

The long hyped S2 of AOT aired 4th to mediocre ratings as well, nothing that airs at that spot does well. Stuff that airs behind DB doesn't do well in general.

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Dragon Ball Super makes the Live+3 Top 25 in 18-49 once again on June 2nd:

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/dvr-ratings/cable-live-3-ratings-for-may-28-june-3-2018

http://programminginsider.com/live3-weekly-ratings-the-americans-series-finale-on-fx-hits-season-highs-and-more-than-doubles-its-original-telecast-viewership/

Dragon Ball Super (ADSM, Sat., 6/2/18 10:30 PM)
– Live+Same Day: 1.074 million viewers / 0.641 million adults 18-49
– Live+3 Day: 1.503 million viewers (+39.94%) / 0.928 million adults 18-49 (+44.77%)

Pretty sweet! Note also in the comments no FLCL: Progressive Live+3 since they do this for primetime ratings only. And finally, for the rest of the 18-49s:

http://programminginsider.com/saturday-final-ratings-golden-knights-capitals-on-nbcsn-post-most-viewed-nhl-stanley-cup-final-game-three-in-3-years/

6/2/18 - Adults 18-49
Show Total Viewers Adults 18-49
Family Guy 594,000  
DBS 640,000 107.74%
DBZKFC 518,000 80.94%
MHA 370,000 71.43%
FLCL 372,000 100.54%
JoJo 273,000 73.39%
HxH 275,000 100.73%
B. Clover 259,000 94.18%
Shippuden 230,000 88.80%
Dandy 199,000 86.52%
Bebop 193,000 96.98%
Lupin 208,000 107.77%
AVERAGE 321,545 12th of 22

That's actually slightly above average so far for 2018!

Edited by OwlChemist81
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4 hours ago, OwlChemist81 said:

This is 6/2/18, not 6/9/18.

It's actually just something I forgot to post because I was too busy at the end of last week, and because I was having computer issues.

I don't think nobody noticed

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32 minutes ago, Blatch said:

You just barely beat me today. Wow, that's absolutely wretched total viewership! At this point, it's like we're playing limbo--how low can you go?? The previous record for a normal lineup at 12:30 AM was 398K, so JoJo just reverse-beat that! And I believe ditto for FLCL: Progressive. Doesn't help that there was NO conflict on Kai and that Super got the block off to a really bad start...

...but there IS a "silver lining" to this dark cloud: DBS WAS #2 in 18-49 and WON THE NIGHT in 18-34 single-handedly among cable originals, with Final Chapters coming in 3rd, FLCL: Progressive coming in 4th, and humble JoJo tying for 9th in 18-34, with all 4 shows making the Top 50 in 18-49. As long as that keeps happening, no matter HOW bad the total viewer numbers are, Toonami's not going anywhere--except MAAAAAAAAYBE on July 7th for a really bizarre event that may involve CN taking over hours that normally belong to [as] for a weekend:

http://www.thefutoncritic.com/news/2018/06/11/pack-your-bags-summer-camp-island-begins-july-7-on-cartoon-network-108313/20180611cartoon01/

Of course, lots of questions still abound as to exactly what the hell this could mean. Will it air for 48 hours on Boomerang only, or on both networks? Will CN REALLY take over hours which normally belong to [as] for a new show, which would effectively pre-empt not only Toonami, but also [as]'s normal Sunday night block? And if so, we might see the following? This really wouldn't be so bad...

6/23: Block as it is now, DBZ Kai showcases its final episode

6/30: DBS; FLCL: Progressive Power Hour premiering episodes 5 & 6 back-to-back, MHA, JoJo, etc...

7/7: Toonami pre-empted for CN Summer Camp Island event

7/14: DBS, 2 NEW SHOWS IN THE 11 PM HOUR (AOTS3? & ???), MHA, JoJo, etc...

And finally, if [as] isn't airing one Saturday night, which would pre-empt Toonami, maybe they'll try a block the previous FRIDAY night?? Might not be a bad time to experiment with an FLCL: Progressive marathon...

Edited by OwlChemist81
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If they do, maybe it should be a little something different, like a night split between 2 back-to-back marathons? It might be fun to run FLCL Progressive Episodes 1-4, followed by Episodes 1-7 of My Hero Academia starting at 12:30? Then the pre-emption July 7th, followed by the last 2 episodes of FLCL Progressive back-to-back at 11 PM on July 14th, THEN debut the 2 new shows (including AOTS3 this time) at 11 and 11:30 on July 21st?

Yeah, I could see that.

Edited by OwlChemist81
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Split marathons on one night is a novel idea, but I dont think it'll ever happen. On the other hand, I am expecting them to double up on FLCL Progressive at some point, which seems like the easiest way to deal with a week without Kai.

Also, expect an FLCL 2 rerun instead of a second new show. I'm not that optimistic.

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... which week would be considered an Independence Day marathon event? Would CN count? If not, when WILL Toonami hold it's marathon?  July 4th comes in the MIDDLE of the week this year!  So many questions!

I do remember seeing DeMarco say DBZ held the #2 spot last weekend, but had no idea how AWFUL the numbers actually were.

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2 minutes ago, elfie said:

... which week would be considered an Independence Day marathon event? Would CN count? If not, when WILL Toonami hold it's marathon?  July 4th comes in the MIDDLE of the week this year!  So many questions!

July 7th is closer to July 4th than June 30th is

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THIS JUST IN...

http://www.showbuzzdaily.com/articles/showbuzzdailys-top-150-saturday-cable-originals-network-finals-6-9-2018.html

CABLE HIGHLIGHTS:  A&E’s LIVE PD led Saturday cable, down 0.07 to 0.60, with lead-out GOTTI: GODFATHER & SON at 0.34.  The Adult Swim late-night line-up performed as follows:  DRAGON BALL at 0.38/0.28 compared to last week’s 0.50/0.40, MY HERO ACADEMIA down 0.07 to 0.22/520K, FLCL PROGRESSIVE down a tenth to 0.19, JOJO’S BIZARRE ADVENTURE down 0.04 to 0.17, HUNTER X HUNTER down 0.05 to 0.16/377K, BLACK CLOVER down 0.05 to 0.15/333K, NARUTO down 0.01 to 0.17/337K, SPACE DANDY down 0.02 to 0.13/260K, COWBOY BEBOP down 0.03 to 0.12/241K, and LUPIN THE 3RD down 0.05 to 0.11/239K.  Hallmark’s original movie PERFECT BRIDE: WEDDING BELLS was at 0.29.  (It was a busy night for theatrical movies, with HBO’s AMERICAN MADE premiering at 0.31, 2 runs of BATMAN V SUPERMAN on TNT, both oddly at 0.29, and TBS’s premiere of THE JUNGLE BOOK at 0.29.)  ID’ FEAR THY NEIGHBOR rose 0.05 to 0.28.  ESPN’s USA SOCCER match was at 0.27.  HGTV’s 2 episodes of MOUNTAIN LIFE were at 0.26/0.25, and lead-in HOUSE HUNTERS RENOVATION was down 0.02 to 0.23.  Fox Sports 1’s UFC PPV PRELIMS was at 0.25.  On Food Network, PIONEER WOMAN ticked up to 0.24, and KITCHEN AT FN ticked down to 0.23.  On TLC, SAY YES TO THE DRESS returned at 0.17, and lead-out I WANT THAT WEDDING was at 0.17.  On OWN, WELCOME TO SWEETIE PIE’S lost 0.02 to 0.12, followed by another episode at 0.10.  Showtime’s limited series PATRICK MELROSE ended its run still off the chart, but up 0.01 to 0.03/197K.  

See, there's the problem. Toonami is already hamstrung enough pitted against the inexplicable abomination that is Live PD each and every week, but when theatrical action movies are shown on TBS and TNT simultaneously, that seems to indicate to me a lack of synergy. Both Batman vs. Superman showings and The Jungle Book beat everything on Toonami in 18-49 besides Dragon Ball Super, and that might be a bit of a problem.

6/9/18 - Total Viewers
Show Viewers Retention
Family Guy  ???  
DBS 802,000 #DIV/0!
DBZKFC 660,000 82.29%
MHA 520,000 78.79%
FLCL 441,000 84.81%
JoJo 391,000 88.66%
HxH 377,000 96.42%
B. Clover 333,000 88.33%
Shippuden 337,000 101.20%
Dandy 260,000 77.15%
Bebop 241,000 92.69%
GITS 239,000 99.17%
AVERAGE   418,273 22nd of 23

Full 18-49s coming up later. Hopefully these numbers will rebound from here though! Oh, in case you were wondering, FLCL Progressive only got about 170K in 18-34. So that's where we are now, sub 200K in 18-34 for a world premiere at midnight. In the old days, those kind of numbers led to immediate schedule shuffling, but in this case it's hard to believe it's really FLCL Progressive's fault. That's why I hope if it gets shuffled for its last 2 episodes, it gets the 11 PM hour.

Edited by OwlChemist81
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Naruto beats Naruto clone, sounds about right. 

The final episodes of Kai have really dragged Toonami down. Losing 20 percent a week and preventing their new shows from airing earlier and actually getting eyeballs on em. I think that Johnsonhood guy was actually right about the DB hour really boning Toonami with people who come just for DB and then fuck off.

FLCL is doing exactly what I expected after the first week, mediocre ratings for a sequel no one wanted for a show that a lot of their viewers aren't going to remember.

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1 hour ago, Daos said:

Naruto beats Naruto clone, sounds about right. 

The final episodes of Kai have really dragged Toonami down. Losing 20 percent a week and preventing their new shows from airing earlier and actually getting eyeballs on em. I think that Johnsonhood guy was actually right about the DB hour really boning Toonami with people who come just for DB and then fuck off.

FLCL is doing exactly what I expected after the first week, mediocre ratings for a sequel no one wanted for a show that a lot of their viewers aren't going to remember.

Well flcl still has 2 more episodes left before it's dropped but with the way the story is it might be sooner

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Sequel no one wants does numbers that are below par.  Is anyone surprised?

Now I’m really interested in seeing how the next batch of Netflix anime does, especially the Saint Seiya remake.  If that does well while FLCL 2 and 3 bomb, that’s going to be telling.

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1 hour ago, Jman said:

Sequel no one wants does numbers that are below par.  Is anyone surprised?

Now I’m really interested in seeing how the next batch of Netflix anime does, especially the Saint Seiya remake.  If that does well while FLCL 2 and 3 bomb, that’s going to be telling.

What do you expect from Demarco the idiot?

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2 minutes ago, Misaka said:

For you?

I'm only giving it 4 episodes to prove to me that it's worth watching it's on 2 episodes that just wasted space on my DVR

Then you should've clarified what you're counting. How many episodes left there really are? Or how many episodes you're willing to take before you quit the show.

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This is a public announcement.

The ratings HAVE dropped on all cable channels. It seems like it dropped drastically once again this past week.  We known this for ages.  We also knew about the new FLCL shows, how Toonami has marketed them to high heaven, and how competition seems to be kicking it while it's lying down on the sidewalk next to the graffiti walls.  This is a thread FOR the ratings, and it is souring the mood ever more. It's BEEN doing that for months now. 

I request you all FFFFUCKIN SHAPE UP before this thread is FUCKIN reported.

Yes, I know this place doesn't have a good mod system in place.

.... but ya'll still have a Report button. >:

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3 minutes ago, Misaka said:

What do you expect from Demarco the idiot?

I hate to say it but sometimes what you want isn’t what the general audience wants.  We know DeMarco and WS love them some Bebop and FLCL to the point I still expect Archer’s series finale next year  to be one giant “Real Folk Blues” reference, but that doesn’t translate to regular viewers.

No one asked for an FLCL sequel.  No one wanted an FLCL sequel besides DeMarco getting his fanfic animated.

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2 minutes ago, Jman said:

I hate to say it but sometimes what you want isn’t what the general audience wants.  We know DeMarco and WS love them some Bebop and FLCL to the point I still expect Archer’s series finale next year  to be one giant “Real Folk Blues” reference, but that doesn’t translate to regular viewers.

No one asked for an FLCL sequel.  No one wanted an FLCL sequel besides DeMarco getting his fanfic animated.

Makes you wonder what lazzo wanted instead of the idiot in charge on the block

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6 minutes ago, elfie said:

This is a public announcement.

The ratings HAVE dropped on all cable channels. It seems like it dropped drastically once again this past week.  We known this for ages.  We also knew about the new FLCL shows, how Toonami has marketed them to high heaven, and how competition seems to be kicking it while it's lying down on the sidewalk next to the graffiti walls.  This is a thread FOR the ratings, and it is souring the mood ever more. It's BEEN doing that for months now. 

I request you all FFFFUCKIN SHAPE UP before this thread is FUCKIN reported.

Yes, I know this place doesn't have a good mod system in place.

.... but ya'll still have a Report button. >:

Every mod will just ignore the reports from here unless it's threats 

So good luck on going crazy there

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...I genuinely hate this thread now. I'm not sure if I'm ever going to even look at it again.

Also, before I leave, can we please rename it so that it doesn't have "You are on a new board"? We've been on it for over a year and a half. It doesn't need to be numbered, either, since a thread can now have infinite replies. Stop sucking so much.

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1 hour ago, elfie said:

This is a public announcement.

The ratings HAVE dropped on all cable channels. It seems like it dropped drastically once again this past week.  We known this for ages.  We also knew about the new FLCL shows, how Toonami has marketed them to high heaven, and how competition seems to be kicking it while it's lying down on the sidewalk next to the graffiti walls.  This is a thread FOR the ratings, and it is souring the mood ever more. It's BEEN doing that for months now. 

I request you all FFFFUCKIN SHAPE UP before this thread is FUCKIN reported.

Yes, I know this place doesn't have a good mod system in place.

.... but ya'll still have a Report button. >:

Hey, I only report the truth, and speculate on potential schedules. He wants to drop a 6-episode show 4 episodes in, that's his business. I sure as hell don't understand it, but then again, I never finished Mob Psycho after watching half the series, and I finished Juni Taisen.

http://programminginsider.com/saturday-final-ratings-over-15-million-watch-justify-win-the-triple-crown-at-the-belmont-stakes-on-nbc/

Family Guy (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 10:00 PM, 30 min.)
– 0.873 million viewers (#37)
– 0.509 million adults 18-49 (0.39 A18-49 rating) (#37)

Dragon Ball Super (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 10:30 PM, 30 min.)
– 0.802 million viewers (#45)
– 0.496 million adults 18-49 (0.38 A18-49 rating) (#40)

Interesting that DBS was #2 in 18-49 among cable originals, but only #40 among all programming. As for the rest...

Dragon Ball Z Kai: The Final Chapters (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 11:00 PM, 30 min.)
– 0.660 million viewers (#73)
– 0.365 million adults 18-49 (0.28 A18-49 rating) (#88)

My Hero Academia (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 11:30 PM, 30 min.)
– 0.520 million viewers (#114)
– 0.284 million adults 18-49 (0.22 A18-49 rating) (#121)

FLCL: Progressive (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 12:00 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.441 million viewers (#133)
– 0.239 million adults 18-49 (0.19 A18-49 rating) (#129)

Jojo’s Bizarre Adventure: Stardust Crusaders (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 12:30 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.391 million viewers (#141)
– 0.217 million adults 18-49 (0.17 A18-49 rating) (#135)

Hunter X Hunter (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 1:00 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.377 million viewers (#143)
– 0.205 million adults 18-49 (0.16 A18-49 rating) (#141)

Black Clover (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 1:30 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.333 million viewers (#146)
– 0.197 million adults 18-49 (0.15 A18-49 rating) (#142)

Naruto: Shippuden (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 2:00 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.337 million viewers (#145)
– 0.217 million adults 18-49 (0.17 A18-49 rating) (#135)

Space Dandy (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 2:30 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.260 million viewers (#151)
– 0.164 million adults 18-49 (0.13 A18-49 rating) (#150)

Cowboy Bebop (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 3:00 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.241 million viewers (#152)
– 0.158 million adults 18-49 (0.12 A18-49 rating) (#151)

Lupin the 3rd: Part 4 (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 3:30 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.239 million viewers (#153)
– 0.144 million adults 18-49 (0.11 A18-49 rating) (#153)

And just in case you wondered how AFTER Toonami is doing, it appears there is still a slight uptick:

Rick & Morty (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 4:00 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.275 million viewers (#150)
– 0.166 million adults 18-49 (0.13 A18-49 rating) (#149)

Rick & Morty (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 4:30 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.276 million viewers (#149)
– 0.167 million adults 18-49 (0.13 A18-49 rating) (#148)

King of the Hill (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 5:00 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.307 million viewers (#148)
– 0.184 million adults 18-49 (0.14 A18-49 rating) (#145)

King of the Hill (R) (ADSM, Sat. 6/09/18 5:30 AM, 30 min.)
– 0.328 million viewers (#147)
– 0.190 million adults 18-49 (0.15 A18-49 rating) (#143)

6/9/18 - Adults 18-49
Show Total Viewers Adults 18-49
Family Guy 509,000  
DBS 496,000 97.45%
DBZKFC 365,000 73.59%
MHA 284,000 77.81%
FLCL 239,000 84.15%
JoJo 217,000 90.79%
HxH 205,000 94.47%
B. Clover 197,000 96.10%
Shippuden 217,000 110.15%
Dandy 164,000 75.58%
Bebop 158,000 96.34%
Lupin 144,000 91.14%
AVERAGE    244,182 22nd of 23
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