The Last Jedi (Spoilers)

[enad]

What a disappointment.  

More later, but when Ben talked about how everything, the Jedi, the First Order, Luke, Supreme Pizza Snookie...all of it should die, I nearly got up to cheer.  The only thing he didn't mention but should have was the Star Wars franchise itself.  

[André Toulon]

It was awesome

[enad]

9 minutes ago, Gogo Yubari said:

It was awesome

Legit, that would have been so much better.  At least I would have laughed at that.  They tried to make me laugh in this one, and it was horrible.  

[NaBarney]

My friend's review

[enad]

Every time they said "Resistance" I cringed.  Twitter moms have ruined that word.  I kept waiting for Dark Sith Russian Lord Bernie to appear and use the Force to make black people kneel for the national anthem.

[enad]

So, a few things wrong with this movie:

1.)  Suicide hyperdrive crash.  Could have happened in the first 5 minutes and all the Rebels would still be alive.  Pointless tension for tension's sake to deploy the tactic when they did.

2.)  Supreme Pizza Snookie reduced to a plot device for Ben Solo and nothing more.  We learn nothing about him, where he came from, how he met Ben, why he's so atuned to the Dark Side, absolutely nothing.  They killed him just so Ben could appear more "conflicted" but then not change anyway.

3.)  The New Republic is gone by the time the movie starts?  How?  The First Order was the size of the Charlottesville protesters in VII.  You expect us to just take that on face value and eat all that missing story?

4.)  Casino subplot.  Completely worthless side story that only exists to give Rose and Finn more interaction to make it more believable when she confesses her love for him, which wasn't believable anyway.

5.)  Luke's Force projection dice that he gave to Leia just disappearing.  That actually is a hysterical dick move in retrospect, but also completely stupid and ruins the tone.

6.)  While we're on the subject of tone, the entire tone of the movie was off at parts.  It reminded me of a lot of the weird slapstick jolts from the prequels, where a scene would be very dark and contemplative and then we'd hard cut to some sort of computer generated cartoon farting or something.  

7.)  What is the "fuel"?  Why would they be running out of it?  And if it's in such precious short supply, why is there enough to send half the cast on a speculative road trip to Space Vegas?

 

There are other complaints, but these are the ones that stick out after a night's sleep.  I actually liked Rey's parents being bums to traded her for some Admiral Nelson's and Luke being a failed Baby Boomer parent Trump voter who won't take responsibility for how he fucked everything.  Everything else in the movie was the wrong decision.  

Edited December 17, 2017 by enad

[Raptorpat]

I was really surprised that he killed off admiral ackbar so unceremoniously and so early, and then they let him continue killing off virtually everyone except the mainest of characters, plus that one alien pilot and Carrie Fisher's daughter, to the point where the entire resistance/rebels could fit inside the millennium falcon.

[enad]

4 minutes ago, Adminderaptorpat said:

I was really surprised that he killed off admiral ackbar so unceremoniously and so early, and then they let him continue killing off virtually everyone except the mainest of characters, plus that one alien pilot and Carrie Fisher's daughter, to the point where the entire resistance/rebels could fit inside the millennium falcon.

I honestly think that was for the sake of Disney franchise maintenance at this point.  They want all the old characters dead so they don't have any dorks screeching at them about canon.  But it's safe to say at this point that JJ Star Wars is the same thing that JJ Star Trek was; a franchise that seeks to purposely push away its old fan base because it doesn't want to be associated with gross nerds for marketing purposes.

Edited December 17, 2017 by enad

[Raptorpat]

But they also killed off knock-off emperor snookie and knock-off Boba Fett phasma, who were brand new and supposedly central to certain characters' development. And also killing snoke off definitely was an admission that he was just a JJ Abrams macguffin and not an actual character.

But the end of the second film in a trilogy seems to be a really odd place to totally reset the deck again, if they were being honest about IX really being the end of the "Skywalker saga".

[enad]

1 minute ago, Adminderaptorpat said:

But they also killed off knock-off emperor snookie and knock-off Boba Fett phasma, who were brand new and supposedly central to certain characters' development. And also killing snoke off definitely was an admission that he was just a JJ Abrams macguffin and not an actual character.

But the end of the second film in a trilogy seems to be a really odd place to totally reset the deck again, if they were being honest about IX really being the end of the "Skywalker saga".

Halfway through I started wondering if Johnson actually watched VII and understood the questions that were set up and required resolution, not as a function of fan service but just good narrative bookkeeping.  I kept suspecting that some one just handed him a bunch of action figures and said "here, play with these."  

[Hornshire]

4 hours ago, enad said:

So, a few things wrong with this movie:

1.)  Suicide hyperdrive crash.  Could have happened in the first 5 minutes and all the Rebels would still be alive.  Pointless tension for tension's sake to deploy the tactic when they did.

2.)  Supreme Pizza Snookie reduced to a plot device for Ben Solo and nothing more.  We learn nothing about him, where he came from, how he met Ben, why he's so atuned to the Dark Side, absolutely nothing.  They killed him just so Ben could appear more "conflicted" but then not change anyway.

3.)  The New Republic is gone by the time the movie starts?  How?  The First Order was the size of the Charlottesville protesters in VII.  You expect us to just take that on face value and eat all that missing story?

4.)  Casino subplot.  Completely worthless side story that only exists to give Rose and Finn more interaction to make it more believable when she confesses her love for him, which wasn't believable anyway.

5.)  Luke's Force projection dice that he gave to Leia just disappearing.  That actually is a hysterical dick move in retrospect, but also completely stupid and ruins the tone.

6.)  While we're on the subject of tone, the entire tone of the movie was off at parts.  It reminded me of a lot of the weird slapstick jolts from the prequels, where a scene would be very dark and contemplative and then we'd hard cut to some sort of computer generated cartoon farting or something.  

7.)  What is the "fuel"?  Why would they be running out of it?  And if it's in such precious short supply, why is there enough to send half the cast on a speculative road trip to Space Vegas?

 

There are other complaints, but these are the ones that stick out after a night's sleep.  I actually liked Rey's parents being bums to traded her for some Admiral Nelson's and Luke being a failed Baby Boomer parent Trump voter who won't take responsibility for how he fucked everything.  Everything else in the movie was the wrong decision.  

We mostly agree with all of this.

Particularly point 3. The First Order existing in the first place is hard enough to buy. That they're on par with the Republic... fine. Have your shitty backdrop for a shitty story. Whatever, those are 7's issues. But to suggest that they can blow up five planets and no one bats an eye is absurd. That after that threat is removed when Death Star III is destroyed, there is not an immediate outpouring of support for the group responsible? Beyond inconceivable. 

We don't really care that Snoke isn't validated, because We never expected him to be, and the fuel issue, while it does pose some plot related questions, isn't a deal breaker.

On the lightspeed kamikaze... We really liked that moment. A large part of that is actually due to a particular audience member letting out an "ohhhh shit" during the otherwise five seconds of silence. Holdo's character, in general though, was pretty worthless. Literally, the most interesting thing about her was figuring out that We knew the actor that played her from Jurassic Park. 

Other points of contention We had with the movie:
- A lot of the dialogue in the beginning was super hammy. Like prequel levels of bad. 
- Leia's only on-screen force usage comes off as a space witch casting a miracle.
- Caretakers not being introduced until they could be suddenly used for more ill conceived humor.

All in all, very unimpressed. Not the worst Star Wars movie ever made, but definitely the worst one not directed by Lucas. A second watching may change Our opinions on certain issues, but We'll wait till it hits the dollar theatre to confirm.

[scoobdog]

7 hours ago, enad said:

So, a few things wrong with this movie:

1.)  Suicide hyperdrive crash.  Could have happened in the first 5 minutes and all the Rebels would still be alive.  Pointless tension for tension's sake to deploy the tactic when they did.

2.)  Supreme Pizza Snookie reduced to a plot device for Ben Solo and nothing more.  We learn nothing about him, where he came from, how he met Ben, why he's so atuned to the Dark Side, absolutely nothing.  They killed him just so Ben could appear more "conflicted" but then not change anyway.

3.)  The New Republic is gone by the time the movie starts?  How?  The First Order was the size of the Charlottesville protesters in VII.  You expect us to just take that on face value and eat all that missing story?

4.)  Casino subplot.  Completely worthless side story that only exists to give Rose and Finn more interaction to make it more believable when she confesses her love for him, which wasn't believable anyway.

5.)  Luke's Force projection dice that he gave to Leia just disappearing.  That actually is a hysterical dick move in retrospect, but also completely stupid and ruins the tone.

6.)  While we're on the subject of tone, the entire tone of the movie was off at parts.  It reminded me of a lot of the weird slapstick jolts from the prequels, where a scene would be very dark and contemplative and then we'd hard cut to some sort of computer generated cartoon farting or something.  

7.)  What is the "fuel"?  Why would they be running out of it?  And if it's in such precious short supply, why is there enough to send half the cast on a speculative road trip to Space Vegas?

 

There are other complaints, but these are the ones that stick out after a night's sleep.  I actually liked Rey's parents being bums to traded her for some Admiral Nelson's and Luke being a failed Baby Boomer parent Trump voter who won't take responsibility for how he fucked everything.  Everything else in the movie was the wrong decision.  

If you're not picking like that, this movie really must be good.

[enad]

11 minutes ago, scoobdog said:

If you're not picking like that, this movie really must be good.

It's meh.

[KreiaDidNothingWrong]

On 12/17/2017 at 10:08 AM, enad said:

So, a few things wrong with this movie:

1.)  Suicide hyperdrive crash.  Could have happened in the first 5 minutes and all the Rebels would still be alive.  Pointless tension for tension's sake to deploy the tactic when they did.

2.)  Supreme Pizza Snookie reduced to a plot device for Ben Solo and nothing more.  We learn nothing about him, where he came from, how he met Ben, why he's so atuned to the Dark Side, absolutely nothing.  They killed him just so Ben could appear more "conflicted" but then not change anyway.

3.)  The New Republic is gone by the time the movie starts?  How?  The First Order was the size of the Charlottesville protesters in VII.  You expect us to just take that on face value and eat all that missing story?

4.)  Casino subplot.  Completely worthless side story that only exists to give Rose and Finn more interaction to make it more believable when she confesses her love for him, which wasn't believable anyway.

5.)  Luke's Force projection dice that he gave to Leia just disappearing.  That actually is a hysterical dick move in retrospect, but also completely stupid and ruins the tone.

6.)  While we're on the subject of tone, the entire tone of the movie was off at parts.  It reminded me of a lot of the weird slapstick jolts from the prequels, where a scene would be very dark and contemplative and then we'd hard cut to some sort of computer generated cartoon farting or something.  

7.)  What is the "fuel"?  Why would they be running out of it?  And if it's in such precious short supply, why is there enough to send half the cast on a speculative road trip to Space Vegas?

 

There are other complaints, but these are the ones that stick out after a night's sleep.  I actually liked Rey's parents being bums to traded her for some Admiral Nelson's and Luke being a failed Baby Boomer parent Trump voter who won't take responsibility for how he fucked everything.  Everything else in the movie was the wrong decision.  

1.) no, they would be dead. They had to get the transports out covertly and get as many people on them as they could. Poe ruined that with his stupid casino mission ruined by a drunk snitch. The thing that was wrong with it in actual writing was that the first order probably could have just let them keep floating away for like 6 hours so they could hyperspace to them without overshooting it.

2.) I agree but they have to sell books or attempt to make it a plot point somehow in the next movie somehow. Snoke's alien army is here, and THEY'RE PISSED or some stupid shit like that.

3.) I wouldn't have a problem with this if there had been an actual time jump consistent with the "taking worlds" thing in the opening crawl. If anything they just destabilized everything when they blew up the Hosnian system and more factions should be popping up. Mandolorians, for example, should be securing their territory. Space pirates should be going nuts. It has literally been like 3 days.

4.) Yes.

5.) yes. Why would he even give her those? lmao

6.) Yeah I had some issues with this too.

7.) first two questions: I don't have an answer for you. The Casino thing was a stupid Poe idea though. It never would have been approved for fuel reasons and his stupid decisions earlier in the movie. This movie focused a lot of time on Poe just being really fucking incompetent.

 

[pail]

[ghostrek]

i like it 

 

i disagree with things but i like it

[BUU8800]

Repost but why the fuck not?

 

I managed to see it yesterday, though unfortunately we got stuck in the fucking parking lot and missed the opening crawl and first few minutes. So I was already pretty pissed before even sitting down to watch it. Maybe that hurt it for me, but honestly it was a 7 out of 10 at best and I feel like I'd feel that way regardless. First let me say that the last hour or so actually saved it. I was really not feeling things early on, and the worst of that feeling came as Finn and whatsherface were riding those goddamn awful looking horses.(Though the tentacle beasts in Force Awakens still looked worse.) That entire casino plot was so fucking boring and unnecessary. Really wish it wasn't in the film. It also felt like the movie was 50% Empire Strikes Back just done out of order or with slight tweeks(Like Hoth? Now it's last instead of first! Enjoyed how the Millenium Falcon's hyper drive wasn't working? Well now we're actually gonna track them by hyper drive or light speed or whatever it was! And wanna see Luke mimic Yoda to train Rey?) 25% Return of the Jedi(As someone whose favorite character in all of Star Wars is Palpatine every time Snoke was on screen I wanted to shout fuck you you awful ripoff! They even used the Emperor's Theme briefly while he was holding up Rey. And then even had him show her her friends dying like Palpatine did to Luke, give me a fucking break. Literally the only thing he didn't do was zap her with Force Lightning, though he did briefly show it off earlier in the film because of fucking course he had to.) and 25% new stuff. Some of which, the casino plot, was a chore to sit through as I've said.

So what did I like? I liked that they killed off Snoke because fuck him. He deserved to go out like a bitch. Hell at least Palpatine was busy shocking the crap out of Luke before Vader blindsided him. I liked most of Luke at the end. Facing the AT AT knockoffs or whatever they were and then Kylo. I didn't like him actually dying though, that seemed unnecessary. I know he'll be a ghost in the next one, but part of me suspects had Disney known Carrie Fisher was gonna die he'd have lived. Ironically she lived in the film too. I felt like Finn probably should have succeeded in sacrificing himself with that kamikaze attack. That would have made a nice moment and fitting end for him but knew there was no chance of it actually happening. I loved the Darth Sidious name drop Luke gave. Like I said, Palpatine's my favorite!  And uh....that might be it? Yoda's random cameo just felt random. Neither good nor bad. It confused me how Frank Oz perfectly mimicked his original trilogy Yoda voice here....but not in the prequels. Did George specifically tell him to make Yoda sound different in those cause they were set in the past? I get he's younger but you wouldn't think an 870 year old creature would sound that drastically different at 900! C-3PO had the opposite problem. Anthony Daniels must be getting old or something because boy was he sounding weak here. And speaking of not to speak ill of the dead or anything but yeah, Carrie Fisher sounded like she was struggling to say her lines. Like she needed to be on oxygen or something may she rest in peace. Her whole little force scene was extremely silly and absurd, but I'm willing to overlook it.

The biggest thing I'm left wondering now is...what's next? Now that this film managed to rip off Empire AND Jedi there's nothing more to rip off for episode IX so it pretty much HAS to be original. Is it really just gonna be Kylo as the big bad? He doesn't really feel powerful enough for that, but who else? Phasma was unceremoniously killed off after doing basically nothing making her this trilogies Boba Fett. And obviously Snoke's gone. At the same time I absolutely DO NOT want to see Snoke somehow magically come back or anything like that so if that's my only other option I'll take Kylo. And Mad Eye Moody's son I guess but I think of him as more of an Admiral Piett kinda character at this point. I really, really, really hope the next film has a good lightsaber fight though regardless. This new trilogy is in sore need of one. The one in the Force Awakens was okay at best and we didn't even actually get one in this film. Not a true one anyway. I don't count Rey and Kylo using them to fight those Emperor's Guard knockoffs. I'd sooner count that brief skirmish Rey had with Luke with the sticks. That I wish had gone on a bit more, that was actually pretty decently cool. People bash the prequel saber duels for being too choreographed or whatnot and that's fair. I certainly still love them but it's fair. But at least give us something on par with Luke vs Vader in Empire or Jedi in episode IX, please. In visual execution at least as I'd say they've already failed in making me care about Rey and Kylo as much as I did Vader and Luke, or Anakin and Obi-Wan, or Yoda and Palpatine. That ship has sailed. I felt indifferent towards the boy showing off force powers ending.

Overall I would much sooner watch the entire original trilogy and Revenge of the Sith over this again any day of the week. Is it better than Force Awakens? I honestly can't decide. Both are 7/10s tops so I don't know. Maybe Star Wars just isn't for me anymore. I don't feel the same connection to these new movies. I'll definitely still give IX a shot though in 2 years, assuming I'm still here and able.