The1gairon Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 12 hours ago, OwlChemist81 said: Best part of this episode: Preparing for more fresh material in case they ever need more story for another Dragonball show = CHECK! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mochi Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 something I feel is worth note apparently the Buu saga happens later in future Trunks timeline than in the main timeline because Trunks is a small child when the Buu Saga happens in the main timeline....but he's an adult in future Trunks timeline when Babidi and Dabura show up why? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokeNirvash Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 Trunks was a teenager when he defeated the Androids and Cell in his timeline. Naturally, it can be assumed that Babidi and Dabura went into action after they were killed, as trying to revive Buu while the Androids were wiping out whoever they could find would've been most inconvenient. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roymustang1990 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 19 hours ago, ben0119 said: Yeah same here. D: We probably won't see anything drawn right in Super. Well Trunks would have been stronger with the "beyond Super Saiyan" level whatever it was called anyway I guess. Oh I see.awesome. yeah that statement seems to be true for goku in this episode too because his hair remained super saiyan 1 while being in super saiyan 2 state. Yeah,the statement "beyond super saiyan is really confusing.I wished they found a better description to explain the existence of super saiyan 1.5 form because they make sound like it was super saiyan 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mochi Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 19 hours ago, ben0119 said: Yeah same here. D: We probably won't see anything drawn right in Super. Well Trunks would have been stronger with the "beyond Super Saiyan" level whatever it was called anyway I guess. actually for the final arc Toei re-hired a bunch of animators from the original DBZ and the animation massively improved so basically in another 60 episodes the animation finally gets better 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daos Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Toriyama complained as well due to Super looking like shit. They really up their game later on, too bad it takes 100 episodes to get to a point where it's worth watching. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daos Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 On 2/3/2018 at 7:50 PM, mochi said: this arc is basically a reflection of what would happen if Goku hadn't gotten Brain Damage as a baby After DBZ ended there was a semi popular fan fic where Goku had his brain injury erased and became evil. It feels like this arc kinda got the idea from that. Ok also.... Whis says time travel isn't allowed because it can affect the past. But guess what? In DBZ it doesn't work like that. When Trunks gave the warning to Goku and friends and returned to his own time everything was exactly the same as when he left. Goku had still died of the heart virus, and the androids were still alive and rampaging. Nothing Trunks does in the past will affect his timeline. The past he traveled to is already a completely different timeline than the one he comes from. Guess the writers forgot again eh? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The1gairon Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 6 hours ago, Daos said: Toriyama complained as well due to Super looking like shit. They really up their game later on, too bad it takes 100 episodes to get to a point where it's worth watching. This puzzles me. The turn-around for an anime is the fastest I ever heard in any kind of animation, yet it still takes the length of time of a Hollywood movie production to fix something!?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daos Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Eh who knows. Sometimes weekly Shonen save their budgets for the final arc. Or just the biggest fights. The last arc has an assload of fights with like 50 different people. I'll never understand why they decided to create a poorly animated version of the movies. They should have saved their money and just started after the Frieza movie. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mochi Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 10 hours ago, Daos said: After DBZ ended there was a semi popular fan fic where Goku had his brain injury erased and became evil. It feels like this arc kinda got the idea from that. Ok also.... Whis says time travel isn't allowed because it can affect the past. But guess what? In DBZ it doesn't work like that. When Trunks gave the warning to Goku and friends and returned to his own time everything was exactly the same as when he left. Goku had still died of the heart virus, and the androids were still alive and rampaging. Nothing Trunks does in the past will affect his timeline. The past he traveled to is already a completely different timeline than the one he comes from. Guess the writers forgot again eh? yeah, their previous canon was that the future can't be changed because once a timeline happens that timeline is severed from all other timelines becoming it's own self contained alternate reality, but now they're having whis claim that meddling in time can change the future....when it can't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben0119 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/5/2018 at 3:44 AM, Daos said: After DBZ ended there was a semi popular fan fic where Goku had his brain injury erased and became evil. It feels like this arc kinda got the idea from that. Ok also.... Whis says time travel isn't allowed because it can affect the past. But guess what? In DBZ it doesn't work like that. When Trunks gave the warning to Goku and friends and returned to his own time everything was exactly the same as when he left. Goku had still died of the heart virus, and the androids were still alive and rampaging. Nothing Trunks does in the past will affect his timeline. The past he traveled to is already a completely different timeline than the one he comes from. Guess the writers forgot again eh? It is still like that. We saw enough just from the future we saw from these past few episodes. Everyone else is still dead except for Trunks, Bulma, and Mai, that we know of. Well, just Trunks now, lol. So, Whis is just an idiot, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben0119 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/4/2018 at 11:34 PM, Roymustang1990 said: Oh I see.awesome. yeah that statement seems to be true for goku in this episode too because his hair remained super saiyan 1 while being in super saiyan 2 state. Yeah,the statement "beyond super saiyan is really confusing.I wished they found a better description to explain the existence of super saiyan 1.5 form because they make sound like it was super saiyan 2 I think Goku might have had the right hair but with the laziness and simpleness of the art it's hard to tell at times. Trunks' new look and Super Saiyan Blue having the exact same eye color as the hair looks bad, by the way. I thought it was called Ascended Super Saiyan, and the roided out form was called Ultra Super Saiyan. Don't recall either of these names actually being said in the show, though. They always just said they had "gone beyond Super Saiyan." Super Saiyan 2 is a pretty obvious different level when it happens, in terms of appearance and ability, though. The hair is slightly longer, with more, smaller, sharper spikes, the muscles aren't blown up like the Ascended Super Saiyan or Ultra Super Saiyan (implying it's faster and more agile in addition the power boost), and there's those awesome blue energy bolts. But it doesn't have a name until well after the fact. DB wiki gives the names and alternate names. http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Super_Saiyan_Second_Grade http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Super_Saiyan_Third_Grade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daos Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 (edited) I mean I guess Trunks affected the current timeline with the warning about the androids? But that happened 10 years ago so not much anyone can do about it now. And without time travel, Cell would have absorbed the androids in the future and destroyed the planet. How is that a better outcome than not using time travel? Nah this arc is totally different than the brain injury thing =P I always heard of it referred to as "mastered super saiyan" , the point where Goku powers up to full power to fight Cell. Edited February 9, 2018 by Daos 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben0119 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Daos said: I mean I guess Trunks affected the current timeline with the warning about the androids? But that happened 10 years ago so not much anyone can do about it now. And without time travel, Cell would have absorbed the androids in the future and destroyed the planet. How is that a better outcome than not using time travel? Nah this arc is totally different than the brain injury thing =P I also just realized that when Whis used his own time travel, it was able to correct events within the same time period, but that was just a short rewind, and was using whatever magic powarz he has, so it probably works different than using a time machine. Maybe he assumed it wasn't different. Still, you'd think a god's attendant would be less ignorant. Yeah that is true. Things would have gone to shit had Trunks not gone back. Also to be fair, this time Trunks was planning to bring help to his timeline, instead of trying to help the past, so it would change it then. But, he couldn't go backwards in his own. So, it's merely getting reinforcements from a separate timeline, which I guess might be against THE RULES, but... it's almost more like getting help from a separate dimension, which traveling between those is apparently just fucking fine. So yeah, this is retarded no matter how you look at it. Should have just had Whis be impressed at the humans achieving that but not the admonishment bit. Yeah, it's too late now, hehe. Well, they don't care about outcomes, so they probably wouldn't see destruction as a bad thing, especially since that was "supposed to happen." Still, with what Elder Kai said about how there was no reason or natural order to Beerus' destruction and how he was basically just a renegade, but then the reveal that Zeno erases universes at a whim, it makes me think this whole god thing is either a stupid concept, or they don't really have a legitimate claim to their positions as "deities" and just self-appointed themselves because they could, due to their powers. I mean, everything up to the Supreme Kais made some semblance of sense, but after that... I'm not familiar with that fanfic. But about that, it makes me wonder, Goku's true personality is what it is because of the head injury, right? They said he was programmed with orders which he forgot when that happened. So does that mean Vegeta wouldn't be an asshole if he had brain damage, too? Well, the Prince probably wouldn't be "programmed." But what about Bardock? He didn't seem to be programmed and was "just following orders," and had a good side to him. Edited February 9, 2018 by ben0119 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben0119 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/4/2018 at 11:39 PM, mochi said: actually for the final arc Toei re-hired a bunch of animators from the original DBZ and the animation massively improved so basically in another 60 episodes the animation finally gets better Oh, thank god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben0119 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/4/2018 at 3:11 PM, PokeNirvash said: Trunks was a teenager when he defeated the Androids and Cell in his timeline. Naturally, it can be assumed that Babidi and Dabura went into action after they were killed, as trying to revive Buu while the Androids were wiping out whoever they could find would've been most inconvenient. Not only that, but you alter one thing about the past, and it creates a domino or butterfly effect. And there could be any number of reasons why Babidi and Dabura showed up when they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben0119 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/4/2018 at 11:08 AM, elfie said: Preparing for more fresh material in case they ever need more story for another Dragonball show = CHECK! Dragon Ball is a friggin institution. Why did they wait until NOW to make Super? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daos Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 Ok so supposedly Goku was feral and vicious as a baby. Supposedly all Saiyans were like that. I don't think Toriyama remembers this. Also, who was supposed to raise baby Goku on Earth? Were they just counting on a random hermit who doesn't mind raising an evil baby to raise him until he was big enough to wipe out humanity? As usual with Dragonball nothing makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben0119 Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 Well I think just the ones that were "programmed." After he hit his head and lost his memory, Goku was kind. So I think that isn't their natural state. Raditz said one of their babies was more than enough to wipe out the life forms on Earth, given the weak power levels of Earthlings. Full Moons would also aide in this. So they would be killing from right when they got there. So I guess they could probably fend for themselves then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mochi Posted February 9, 2018 Share Posted February 9, 2018 8 hours ago, Daos said: Ok so supposedly Goku was feral and vicious as a baby. Supposedly all Saiyans were like that. I don't think Toriyama remembers this. Also, who was supposed to raise baby Goku on Earth? Were they just counting on a random hermit who doesn't mind raising an evil baby to raise him until he was big enough to wipe out humanity? As usual with Dragonball nothing makes sense. the drastic Change in Vegeta's behavior in Super also contradicts Canon according to canon all of Universe 7's Saiyans are inherently viscious and evil (or so says King Kai) yet Vegeta is now nice it's why my personal belief is that Vegeta was always nice he was just severely mentally unstable and adapted a kill or be Killed mentality from all the shit that happened to him as a kid, such as being abducted by frieza having most of his species wiped out and being trained BY Frieza to use his abilties to wipe planets of all native live so they could be sold on that note are we completely sure that Frieza wasn't specifically told to genocide planets by Beerus....because that's basically what Beerus does as well, he just doesn't re-sell the planets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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