OwlChemist81

Quite true. Occasionally I'll even get "stuck" out almost that late!

Thinking about catching the dub later tonight!

That is quite sad.

You could argue that a few other shows have kinda gotten "GXP"'ed: ThunderCats, in the middle of its ill-fated 2nd run on Toonami (which would end at Episode 15 due to Toonami losing the rights), fell from 1:30 all the way to 3:30 when One Piece premiered, but of course it was a rerun. OG Naruto started over at 2:30 AM on 1/4/14, abandoning 12:30 after the first Month of Movies One Piece was premiering new episodes at 1 AM right behind Shippuden on 1/31/15, and it fell to 2:30 on 2/7/15 when the block got cut short. Naruto Shippuden fell from midnight on 1/31/15 all the way to 2 AM only 3 months later on 3/28/15. Parasyte, when it had finished its first run, fell from 1 AM on 4/9/16 to 3 AM on 4/16/16. (Hunter x Hunter took its place) And most recently, Gundam Unicorn was at 1 AM on 3/18/15, then dropped to 2 AM on 3/25/15 when Tokyo Ghoul premiered. (This also continued an "easing down" from a Midnight series premiere for Gundam IBO Season 1, which finished its run at 1 AM). Hopefully something similar is about to happen to Samurai Jack and Tokyo Ghoul since they're currently not pulling their weight in their current timeslots. And just for the record, the following shows are in the exclusive club which have "reverse GXP-ed:" Thundercats - 2:30 AM to 1 AM Hellsing Ultimate - 3 AM to Midnight InuYasha: The Final Act - 2 AM to 12:30 Samurai Jack - Old episodes ended on 1/17/15 at 5:30 AM, but the 5th season premiered at 11 PM on 3/11/17! Will AOT join their ranks, bouncing from 12:30 all the way to 11 PM for its final 3 episodes? Only time will tell!

Oh, I believe you are correct, but not until after another show has its shot at 11 PM. Of course I'm talking about Attack on Titan Season 2 on July 1st! Then wouldn't be wonderful if it could really finish its run there instead of 12:30 AM?

THANK YOU, whoever posted this! No wait, that doesn't quite help me enough. We need to look at the bigger picture... TOTAL VIEWERS RETENTION 8:00 PM Dragon Ball Super 750,000 10:30 PM Family Guy 1,240,000 11:00 PM Samurai Jack S5 #2 884,000 (71.29%) 11:30 PM Dragon Ball Super 856,000 (96.83%) 12:00 AM DBZ Kai: The Final Chapters 893,000 (104.32%) 12:30 AM Attack on Titan Season 2 717,000 (80.29%) 1:00 AM Tokyo Ghoul 583,000 (81.31%) 1:30 AM Hunter × Hunter 574,000 (98.46%) 2:00 AM Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn 530,000 (92.33%) 2:30 AM Naruto: Shippuden 513,000 (96.79%) 3:00 AM Ghost In The Shell HD 469,000 (91.42%) TOTAL VIEWERS AVERAGE - 668,778 If you think that drop from FG to SJ was hellish, you ain't seen nothing yet!! ADULTS 18-49 RETENTION 8:00 PM Dragon Ball Super 317,000 10:30 PM Family Guy 724,000 11:00 PM Samurai Jack S5 #2 497,000 (68.65%) 11:30 PM Dragon Ball Super 510,000 (102.62%) 12:00 AM DBZ Kai: The Final Chapters 537,000 (105.29%) 12:30 AM Attack on Titan Season 2 465,000 (86.59%) 1:00 AM Tokyo Ghoul 377,000 (81.08%) 1:30 AM Hunter × Hunter 389,000 (103.18%) 2:00 AM Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn 372,000 (95.63%) 2:30 AM Naruto: Shippuden 341,000 (91.67%) 3:00 AM Ghost In The Shell HD 331,000 (97.07%) TOTAL VIEWERS AVERAGE - 424,333 Samurai Jack reruns, under 70%!? I give you a "D". The A+'s were DBS, DBZK, and HxH. GITS was #4, and Gundam closed out its run rounding out the Top 5. CURRENT SHOW AVERAGES Total Viewers Dragon Ball Super (8 PM) - 871,952 (21 episodes) Dragon Ball Super (11:30 PM) - 1,120,250 (21 episodes) Dragon Ball Z Kai: Final Chapters - 1,016,545 (22 episodes) Attack On Titan Season 2 - 794,571 (7 episodes) Tokyo Ghoul - 703,200 (10 episodes) Hunter × Hunter - 813,094 (54 episodes) Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn - 653,636 (22 episodes) Naruto: Shippuden - 851,716 (160 episodes) Ghost In The Shell HD - 503,222 (18 episodes) Adults 18-49 Dragon Ball Super (8 PM, Estimate) - 421,571 (21 episodes) Dragon Ball Super (11:30 PM) - 679,250 (21 episodes) Dragon Ball Z Kai: Final Chapters - 614,818 (22 episodes) Attack On Titan Season 2 - 481,286 (7 episodes) Tokyo Ghoul - 437,900 (10 episodes) Hunter × Hunter - 484,642 (54 episodes) Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn - 400,091 (22 episodes) Naruto: Shippuden - 472,893 (143 episodes) Ghost In The Shell HD - 314,556 (18 episodes) Adults 18-34 (Estimated) Dragon Ball Super (8 PM) - 269,750 (20 episodes) Dragon Ball Z Kai: Final Chapters - 414,500 (22 episodes) Attack On Titan Season 2 - 309,571 (7 episodes) Tokyo Ghoul - 288,900 (10 episodes) Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn - 271,727 (22 episodes) Thanks for the memories, Gundam Unicorn! (Not to mention DVR recordings...) You managed to finish above 400K 18-49 after all!!

Whoever thought the fucking Cleveland Show would work after 8 PM Dragon Ball Super should be ashamed at him/herself! I could have told ya that shit wouldn't fly!

What the hell would you have them do, premiere a new episode at 3:30 AM!? Granted, the ratings have been about as bad as some shows got during the "Glorious Era" of 2015-2016 right after Toonami but that's still ridiculous! Dubbing crews probably LOVE stuff like this! They're overworked as it is for goodness sake! Plus this will give us a chance to see what AOT can do at 11 for once!

Ah, thanks for clearing that up. They actually mentioned they were on the air on an episode of Pre-Flight which streamed, but I guess that was only a trial size for the spring.

Often overlooked is the fact that Toonami Pre-Flight gets aired on TV now on Fridays at 4 AM (During what was formerly DVR Theater), BUT since this IS a Toonami thread, I think it bears mention, especially because something really bizarre happened this week: http://www.showbuzzdaily.com/articles/showbuzzdailys-top-150-friday-cable-originals-network-finals-6-9-2017.html#comment-174699 The two halves averaged a 0.33 in Adults 18-49. That beats Tokyo Ghoul and Gundam Unicorn's 0.29 this week. They also averaged a 0.385, which edges Gundam's 0.38 and beats Ghoul's 0.36 as well. Let that sink in. Perhaps an acceptable substitute for Jack at 11 PM would actually be "Toonami: Pre-Flight"!? If repackaged would people actually watch a full 22-minute news program right before Toonami kicked off in earnest at 11:30? If nothing else, it could be a decent follow-up to Dragon Ball Super at 8 PM. Also, we have an update, and I am pleased to report that Between Ghoul and Gundam, Hunter x Hunter beat both in Adults 18-49, and everything was up on Toonami after midnight: http://www.showbuzzdaily.com/articles/showbuzzdailys-top-150-saturday-cable-originals-network-finals-6-10-2017.html "The Adult Swim late-night line-up performed as follows: DRAGON BALL Z up 0.02 to 0.42, ATTACK ON TITAN up 0.05 to 0.36, TOKYO GHOUL up 0.01 to 0.29, MOBILE SUIT GUNDAM up 0.06 to 0.29, HUNTER X HUNTER up 0.05 to 0.30/574K, NARUTO up 0.03 to 0.27/513K, and GHOST IN THE SHELL up 0.06 to 0.26/469K." Why is that show not on earlier!? 12-3:30 AM TOTAL VIEWER RETENTION: 12:00 AM DBZ Kai: The Final Chapters 893,000 12:30 AM Attack on Titan Season 2 717,000 (80.29%) 1:00 AM Tokyo Ghoul 583,000 (81.31%) 1:30 AM Hunter × Hunter 574,000 (98.46%) 2:00 AM Mobile Suit Gundam Unicorn 530,000 (92.33%) 2:30 AM Naruto: Shippuden 513,000 (96.79%) 3:00 AM Ghost In The Shell HD 469,000 (91.42%)

That may be, but I'm sure it still can't happen until at least it premieres on Toonami first in the case of the dub premieres. If you're talking about AOT, obviously VRV gets it at the same time FUNimation does on Sunday nights. If VRV is able to beat that somehow with Dragon Ball Super, Hunter x Hunter, and now Lupin The 3rd, color me surprised!

The success or failure of Dragon Ball Super at 8 PM can usually be attributed to its CN movie lead-in. This past week, it was a fairly stupid choice: https://cnschedulearchive.tumblr.com/ Yes, that's right. An old Ben 10 movie from 2007! And we've got another one coming up next week as Super's lead-in so I don't see it getting much better.

We interrupt this inane discussion about theme parks to give you a look at the reason this thread was created: the RATINGS! http://www.showbuzzdaily.com/articles/showbuzzdailys-top-150-saturday-cable-originals-network-finals-6-10-2017.html 6/10/2017 Dragon Ball Super (8 PM) - #21 (-11) Adults 18-34 Rating - 0.28 Estimated 18-34 - 190,000 ( 25.33% ) Adults 18-49 Rating - 0.25 Estimated 18-49 - 321,000 ( 42.80% ) Total Viewers - 750,000 6/10/2017 DBZ Kai: Final Chapters - #4 (+2) Adults 18-34 Rating - 0.54 Estimated 18-34 - 367,000 ( 41.10% ) Adults 18-49 Rating - 0.42 Estimated 18-49 - 538,000 ( 60.25% ) Total Viewers - 893,000 6/10/2017 Attack On Titan - #6 (+5) Adults 18-34 Rating - 0.47 Estimated 18-34 - 319,000 ( 44.49% ) Adults 18-49 Rating - 0.36 Estimated 18-49 - 462,000 ( 64.44% ) Total Viewers - 717,000 6/10/2017 Tokyo Ghoul - #9 (+11) Adults 18-34 Rating - 0.36 Estimated 18-34 - 245,000 ( 42.02% ) Adults 18-49 Rating - 0.29 Estimated 18-49 - 372,000 ( 63.81% ) Total Viewers - 583,000 6/10/2017 Gundam Unicorn - #11 (+26) Adults 18-34 Rating - 0.38 Estimated 18-34 - 258,000 ( 48.68% ) Adults 18-49 Rating - 0.29 Estimated 18-49 - 372,000 ( 70.19% ) Total Viewers - 530,000 THE GOOD: EVERYTHING IMPROVED. 'NUFF SAID. As long as we keep going like this, we should be OK. Also, a pretty respectable finish for Gundam Unicorn given the ridiculously huge amount of handicaps that were thrown its way in the 2nd half: it managed to finish just over 650K total viewers and, for all intents and purposes, exactly 400K adults 18-49 on average. Had it not been buried at 2 AM, given the worst lead-in ever in Tokyo Ghoul, AND kneecapped even worse right at the end of its run with the Reruns Power Hour kicking off Toonami, it might have gotten over 700K and 450K respectively, but we'll never know. THE BAD: The whole post-midnight portion of the block got its ass kicked by SPONGEBOB. And whatever that "LIVE PD" show on A&E is, I believe it will just continue to grow to be a thorn in Toonami's side as it steals viewers from the 11 PM hour, not to mention Family Guy before. Ugh. America's obsession with law enforcement sickens me. I prefer there to be some comedy thrown in, like with World's Dumbest Criminals on Tru TV. THE UGLY: Dragon Ball Super, what the hell? Considering it wasn't actually Frieza himself but a bunch of his underlings fighting, I guess I'll give it a pass. But the night that replays what was covered in that Toonami Sneak Peek of Resurrection of F that popped a random episode of DBZ Kai over 2M is coming soon, and if things don't change, it's going to be UGLY! Also, Tokyo Ghoul got beat in 18-34 and Men 12-34 by the finale of Gundam Unicorn, which proves that it really doesn't have any business at 1 AM. Only time will tell if HxH actually went up, down, or tied the relative tie that was between Gundam and Ghoul in 18-49, and of course HERE COMES LUPIN next week to REALLY make Ghoul look inferior!

Yes, as a matter of fact, I have. Almost every week Toonami has been lower than last year's Toonami than [as] as a whole for the week has been lower than last year's [as] week as a whole, and that's not a good thing.

Any predictions on what the ratings might be tomorrow? Here's my stab: Samurai Jack - 1050K DB Super - 975K DBZ Kai - 1025K AOT S2 - 875K Tokyo Ghoul - 750K Hunter x Hunter - 675K Gundam Unicorn - 600K Shippuden - 525K GITS - 450K I believe that since there was no significant competition from NHL or UFC, we'll see a pretty good increase for each timeslot, and Gundam Unicorn might even crack 600K for its final episode!

I never had a problem with any of them personally. Just repeatin what happened to be a common complaint!

I'll tell you what I believe would work just as well as or better than reruns of Samurai Jack appear to have so far at 11 PM: [drumroll] JoJo's Bizarre Adventure, Part 3 A.K.A. Stardust Crusaders Why? Because it seems to have that "it" factor along with Dragon Ball Super for a power hour, and it contains more of what JoJo is known for, i.e.: Also, the annoying bad British accents will be gone, so if boosting AOT S2 to 11 PM with only a few episodes left is a stretch, perhaps they'd take a chance on dub premieres (beyond the first 3 episodes, of course) of the next season of JoJo? Also, no excuse not to play full OP/ED at that time, which of course the latter is The Bangles' "Walk Like An Egyptian!" What would you like YOUR Toonami to be like on July 29th? Here's what I'd like mine to be: 11 PM JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Stardust Crusaders 11:30 Dragon Ball Super 12 AM DBZ Kai Final Chapters 12:30 Mobile Suit Gundam: Iron-Blooded Orphans Season 2 1 AM Hunter x Hunter 1:30 Lupin the 3rd 2 AM Naruto: Shippuden 2:30 Tokyo Ghoul Root A 3 AM Samurai Jack (later AOT S2) 3:30 Ghost In The Shell Gotta get back, back to the back, Samurai Jack!

I don't see any shuffling until July 8th, and that's presuming they do what most are anticipating and run an Attack on Titan Season 2 marathon of the first 9 episodes (#26-#34) on July 1st, then play the revised schedule promo during AOT's marathon that night. But that's only IF Samurai Jack reruns don't do well enough in June. We have averaged one new schedule promo per month so far this year, so I don't believe one that "shuffles the deck" for July 8th, then is quickly replaced with a new one on July 29th when Attack on Titan leaves would be that much more than trivial, especially if, like in May, the schedule stays the same for August. And I don't see any major changes, except maybe for Samurai Jack. But if that gets shuffled to a later timeslot on the 8th, then its replacement in August might not get its own schedule promo, but just a promo announcing its premiere on the block. But there are many questions left to be answered. For example, we don't know if a show other than Samurai Jack will air at 11 PM as part of Toonami on July 1. Whether it's Dragonball Super, Attack on Titan, or whatever, programming could just decide to play the first episode at 11:30 after the usual Toonami rerun of Jack (AOT would have to expand Toonami to 4 AM to get in all the episodes that have premiered thus far). But we still don't know exactly WHAT they are going to do with July 1st even, so all of this is speculation until something official is announced. If another show takes 11 PM from Jack on July 1st, then Jack also might not occupy 11 PM on July 8th and beyond! Lots of questions to be answered in July, but if they play their cards right, it could turn Toonami around significantly in the 2nd half of the year and even poise the 4th Quarter to beat last year's lackluster 4th Quarter!

1. They don't have any genitalia at all, and 2. Even if they did, rubbing your dong in another man's face when he doesn't want it there is a clear sign of aggression!

You might be right. But Lupin would at least seem to be more comedy than action, something that was once considered an asset for an early show in the block (remember Space Dandy?) You could also argue (and rightfully so) that Super is equal parts silly, low-brained comedy and eye-popping action. I think Lupin would have bridged that gap well. Maybe not BE though.

You have a point. I made one reference to a "dumb" decision in the OP so I changed that to "questionable." It's not really insulting to use that Q word...

Well, it's been a hell of a first 5 months for Toonami, and not in a good way. There have been some bright spots but in terms of viewership compared to last year it's been mostly pure :poop:! How did we get here? Well, let's start at the beginning, or rather late last year. Everyone was losing their :poop: on December 7th over the announcement that Toonami had not only acquired the continuation to the wildly successful Dragon Ball Z Kai for the midnight slot, but had also acquired ITS continuation Dragon Ball Super to air at 11:30. Toonami was re-acquiring an earlier timeslot for the new Dragon Ball series, and everything seemed right with the world. Moreover, as Gundam IBO was panned for not including many combat elements, such as laser beams and beam sabers that made Gundam popular, fans were glad to learn that a Universal Century Gundam that contained these things was on its way. It seemed that the new year would usher in a brand new glorious era for Toonami and erase some of the shortcomings seen in the 4th Quarter of 2016. And then the year began with January, but not without one final wrinkle: the 11:30 DBS airings during Toonami would actually be same-night encores of a sparsely-advertised premiere at 8 PM. This had an effect which was probably obvious to everyone but Programming: despite the fact that the 11:30 airing was the "official" airing, those who watched the 8 PM airing and only wanted to see dubbed DBS wouldn't come back for the later airing if they only wanted to watch DBS, not everything else Toonami has to offer. This was merely exacerbated by a short-lived Samurai Jack Season 1 rerun beginning on January 14th which always failed to gain on its Super predecessor. And so it was that the block was only watched by 800K average through the month, a 12% decrease from last year despite the earlier start time. This pattern continued through February, though things began to be looking up. JoJo and Gundam, previously capable only of ratings in the 800Ks in 2017, managed to peak above 900K for the first time on 2/25/17, and Hunter x Hunter was able to cross 800K for the first time in 2017 that week as well. Nonetheless, Toonami's "sleeper" success was only slight since the block averaged 807K and was down from last year by 21%. News spread that Samurai Jack would premiere at 11 PM on 3/11/17, which looked like would augment that burgeoning success... However, the opposite happened. The night that Jack premiered on the 2nd week in March, JoJo, Gundam, and Hunter x Hunter all hit scary new lows. And it was obvious to probably everyone but Programming why: a more attractive viewing option was watching Super, [as] comedy reruns, then Jack, turning off the TV or changing the channel during the 2nd Super. And that's exactly what occurred, but there was one stalwart, embattled show on the other end of the block, the anchor show One Piece. And despite its flagging ratings, there was a general feeling that things would be OK as long as it remained. That was not meant to be, as it was announced on March 10th that it would leave the lineup and be replaced with Tokyo Ghoul. Not only that, but TG would premiere at 1, causing Gundam to fall to 2, and Shippuden to 2:30. This actually seemed like a decent move at first, especially because the ratings that night were the highest yet in 2017 -- 885K, and March average was a year-to-date high 842K, though still down 13% from last year. And then Rick and Morty happened on April 1st, temporarily and without warning shortening Toonami to its old 12-3:30 runtime, also delaying Samurai Jack and Dragon Ball Super for a week. Ratings that night were the 2nd lowest of the year to date, at 621K--more on that later. And it didn't recover from there. JoJo had a 2-part season conclusion out of nowhere with no on-air promotion, and even with Attack on Titan Season 2 joining the lineup at 12:30 AM, Toonami would only manage a 769K average across all its timeslots, another 13% decline from last year, the lowest to date in 2017 and also the lowest monthly average since the January 2015 lineup which included many later timeslots. Say what you want about Samurai Jack's "Gurren Lagann tribute" ending, but it actually set things somewhat right in May, although Attack on Titan was a severe disappointment, dropping 150K or more from its DBZ Kai lead-in (72K or more 18-49), and it's mindboggling that it didn't premiere further up in the lineup than 12:30, being a dub premiere. Perhaps if Kai were after it at 12:30, people would have stuck around to watch it? One smart move they made was the Samurai Jack marathon, which tied up the month nicely and for the first time in 2017 actually gained on its previous year's predecessor by 21%. This left us with an average of 807K in May, but yet another 13% decrease from last year for the month. And then June began, and one more questionable decision ensued, as Toonami persisted with reruns of Samurai Jack at 11 PM, leading to an hour of straight-up RERUNS kicking off Toonami. So far this kicked off the month of June with a worse average than it's gotten since 12/13/14, a mere 615K. And then last but not least, the 2015 reboot of Lupin the 3rd was announced for 6/17--AT 2 AM. Yes, a brand-spanking new dub premiere BURIED in the back of the block while an hour of RERUNS leads the block. Need I say more? Hopefully Toonami will turn it around in the 2nd half of the year. July 8th, after the Independence Day holiday, would be a good time to shuffle the schedule and give the newer shows a better chance to shine. Also, then Tokyo Ghoul will end its decent first season and go to its anime-original Root A 2nd season, so maybe it will get buried at 2 AM and give Hunter x Hunter and Lupin better timeslots? Also, SOMETHING will be replacing Attack on Titan on July 29th, and we can only hope it's something good. It's been a hell of a first half of the year, but I still have high hopes for the 2nd half!

Yes, but WHY is that the only other option? Why could they not show some backbone and USE the 11 PM timeslot for cable original programming? SOMETHING that would make a good lead-in to Dragon Ball Super--wait, I've got it--LUPIN! Or if not Lupin, then maybe gone after Blue Exorcist: Kyoto Saga? That would have done well at 11; instead, looks like it will wind up on Hulu. Point is, 11 should be a marquee timeslot for a fresh new show. Even if FLCL is coming, it's not like they couldn't play up a "mid-season finale" before FLCL interrupts!

It's back on the stream this week, and we've gone all the way back to the first 5 episodes (99-103 in the series as a whole), but for some reason the full OP has been cut from Episode 99, when it played in full on air, and I believe the last time they streamed. Why do they do that online when runtime doesn't matter??