CountFrylock

7 hours ago, Daos said:

And tournament of power was the only good arc, lol.

It really is an awful show by any metric you judge it by. It exists purely for nostalgia the same way Boruto exists.

and we shouldn't have the lead slot taken up by DBS Reruns for nostalgia.....it worked last year when toonami couldn't find any new content and was desperate to air anything

but that isn't so much the case anymore...Dr Stone S2 and MHA S5 will soon arrive on the block

yet they insist it's not time to let go of DBS Reruns as the leader

7 hours ago, elfie said:

I wonder if the day will ever come when Manning and her predecessors will realize Dragonball Super gets the best ratings BECAUSE they put it earlier in the day, not because it's Dragonball Super.

i don't think they ever will...they seem to believe it's because nothing else can compete with it

which is funny because really? you think Dub episodes of the newest MHA Season couldn't compete with 2 year old DBS Reruns?!

they want more eyes on toonami however reruns of something the audience has already seen isn't a good way to do that

9 hours ago, brianycpht said:

I feel like this is a big transition year for AS. Losing FG means they have to restructure the whole schedule. They seem to be playing it safe by loading up on more American Dad and green lighting more half hour comedies that feel a little more “normal” than the bizarre things they have picked up in the past. 
 

It feels like they won’t move away from Dragonball because it’s the surest of sure things and it may be hanging around even after it reaches the end. I don’t think the originals have the “lead show” factor and I can see them insist Super air in front of those as well

it only seems like the surefire thing because they refuse to give anything else a chance  they gave MHA S4 a chance and stood by it in the front position even when remote dubbing caused problems for it

yet now they think it's some low tier show that had it's chance and failed

8 minutes ago, brianycpht said:

That’s kind of what I mean. Every live tweet means someone is watching it I don’t mean so much the sites that out out automated tweets when shows start but if you’re actively watching it tweeting out things like

 

“Wow! This thing just happened in the ToP. # Dragonball Super #Toonami” that shows them active audience engagement with the show. If you like the show, fine. But if you’re doing it out of some obligation to Toonami, you’re just telling them you’re watching it. 
 

Basically, the best thing you can do if you hate Super on the block is to completely ignore it. At the very minimum, you are taking 30 minutes of your life back. I’ve been tuning in at 12:30 since the rerun started. That’s all I do. I don’t stress about it, I just ignore it. If they ever replace it with a new show- great! If not, I’ll just keep ignoring it lol

 

The best we can hope for is MHA beating Super regularly 

the chances of MHA doing that are very unlikely....we all know a significant portion of the audience leaves after the DBS Rerun

and we all know the trend is for the block to do worse as the night goes on

DBS has the lead slot so the chances of anything beating it aren't likely

14 minutes ago, brianycpht said:

I don’t care so much about whether people are counted toward Nielsen. But I have you ask myself why so many in the “Toonami” online community actively live tweet Super or even Tweet that it’s about to start when they are against the show being on the block. I feel like it’s out of obligation to hype up everything the block airs no matter how much they hate it. The community shouldn’t help the show trend if they don’t want it on the block 

I Don't even live tweet anything because I Know my opinions and thoughts don't affect anything

i know the toonami fan accounts typically live tweet DBS because they live tweet everything toonami related regardless what they think(that includes the toonami news account)

because they'd find it hard to just pretend it's not on the block when it is

but who knows maybe if we all just stopped posting about DBS online and never said anything about it

It would get demoted...pfft yeah right

i think DBS reruns are here to stay even if nobody tweeted about them or very few did

but because it's dragon ball You won't have nobody tweeting about it even in reruns

because..."Nostalgia" pushes that dragon ball is the best mindset

those of us who have a problem with DBS Reruns are unfortunately in the minority

more people are actually happy DBS Reruns are on the block than unhappy

if that wasn't the case then DBS Reruns wouldn't even be on the block

8 minutes ago, brianycpht said:

I would just ignore Super and pretend Toonami starts at 12:30. I see a lot of the fanbase complaining about it, but still watching it, live tweeting it during the whole show, ect. It seems like collectively as a fanbase we don’t like this show airing on the block, yet there still seems to be this need hype up everything the block is airing. That’s a metric that contributes to it continuing to air. I can see the casual viewers do it, but a lot the same people who hate that it’s airing feel the need to actually promote its airing all the way through the show just because it’s on Toonami.

well a lot of us can't really do much about it's placement on the block since the majority of us who have a problem with it being the lead show have never been selected for the Nielsen survey

so our viewership doesn't mean jack to Adultswim  i imagine if a shit ton of people tweeted about MHA S5 it wouldn't have any effect on it's time slot

it wouldn't suddenly be catapulted to Lead Show

I've ignored super this long however it's presence on the block as the lead show continues to be a mystery and them insisting it'll be here until it's run concludes with a hint that perhaps it'll be replaced by a nostalgia fueled pick

makes me think ignoring the lead slot will become a toonami tradition

so regardless of what i say or do  the result will still be the same

toonami desperately trying to get people who don't like anime to watch anime

i think dragon ball needs to stop being seen as this amazing franchise that can never be topped and is the only anime worth mentioning

Dragon ball super isn't anything special yet because it's dragon ball related you had people going nuts over it and acting like Ultra Instinct Goku was the hypest shit ever

but now we know how much of a chore  it was to watch the tournament of power and yet there are people still doing that for the reruns...

I Think Nostalgia made a lot of people believe Dragon ball super was better than it actually was

12 hours ago, elfie said:

This has been my main issue for years. It's always been the block of "Dragonball, and then Some Shit We Don't Care Whatever The Hell About".  It's like why even bother having a block at all?? Why not sure air Dragonball if Kim likes it so much!?

they have to realize toonami doesn't need dragon ball all the time....there's other stuff than just dragon ball

the audience who would still be drooling over dbs reruns probably don't care about any other anime and so they don't care about toonami

another thing....someone on the anime superhero/toon zone forums mentioned "Nostalgia is the only reason toonami was brought back" however that shouldn't mean nostalgia has to be what's powering toonami

A Weekly block filled with classic anime would seem neat at first but then You'd quickly lose interest

9 minutes ago, brianycpht said:

Maybe the long term plan is to have a stream of originals constantly premiering and encoring in the lead slot. With so many productions happening simultaneously, I could see it. Add in Ballmastrz, Final Space, and Primal premiering their next seasons on Toonami and they’d have plenty of material to occupy the slot 

Uzumaki=Too Niche to expect a casual american audience to gobble it up(can't imagine a mainstream audience would easily get into Junji Ito's bizarre work)

Blade Runner=The Last Movie was a flop so this surely isn't gonna be some super popular hit

7 minutes ago, brianycpht said:

So I’m wondering if it’s even known whether MHA will run one or two fours this time around. 
If it’s split then they may be torn on whether or not it’s worth it to give MHA the lead only for it to go be gone in 12 weeks 

 

if it’s a full season than it’ll last until November/December. DBS would finish in September right around the same time FG finishes. Then they have a decision to make.

 

Do you give it to MHA with 2 months left or do you loop DBS back to episode 1?
 

If you give it to MHA at any point, it will end in November so then they’d have to figure out the lead slot again. If it’s not a long runner, then they’ll have to constantly consider this. Ideally, you could have a Demon Slayer and MHA turn taker if the seasons work out. But what other shows could take the lead slot?

I almost feel like they leave Super there forever because it’s a sure thing easier than having to figure that out constantly. Not saying I agree with that but I imagine that goes into their decision making 

I'm pretty sure MHA Won't stop abruptly and will be around 25 episodes like the last season

it isn't attack on titan after all and looking it up on wikipedia just to make sure

the series has never had that Stop-Gap(Part 1/Part 2)Set up in it's Japanese Release Schedule

11 minutes ago, brianycpht said:

Ironically, many would rather watch the old Ocean/Funimation dub (censored) with the dub music then Funimation’s 2007 remaster or Kai. 
 

Just like they’d love to see the Dic/Cloverway SM than the Viz redub or crystal 

 

But as much as people say they want that, I doubt they’d tune in to something like that week after week 

which is why i think trying to pander to those people is a stupid idea

trying to say "A Nostalgia Fueled Pick" for the lead spot on modern toonami would be a good way to draw an audience makes no business sense whatsoever

You Don't See Fox Thinking of airing reruns of old  shows in prime time ahead of newer shows like it's the best idea ever...

so i have no idea where they are getting this business strategy from....

but it seems backwards and nonsensical

Keeping DBS Reruns upfront ahead of MHA S5 is like keeping the Training Wheels on a bike and claiming it's better than one without them

just like you can't improve if you never take off the training wheels

toonami can't do any better if they stubbornly refuse to let any other show lead the block

they want more people watching the block and keeping DBS Super Reruns in the first slot leads to that common problem

the casual audience tuning out and never returning after The DBS Rerun Concludes

so how does this help toonami at all?

are they insane...has adultswim finally lost it's mind?!

50 minutes ago, brianycpht said:

Its kind of like this...

The casual viewer who still sits in front of the TV is probably a little older and would remember what's considered the "good years" of AS/CN/Toonami. DB is a crossover show that viewers of FG on TV would be willing to watch because they are probably of that generation who watched CN from 2000-lets say 2007. They assume that a large portion of that group watches DB because of the nostalgia factor and would be more willing to watch an anime if its a familiar title from that time period. They are looking to recapture those memories of watching anime on CN/AS from their childhood/teen years. A modern title wouldn't work there because that person would more associate it with streaming. They believe that a person of that generation would be willing to stick around if they saw a familiar show presented in the way they remember watching it in the past (via Toonami and TOM). It's why people went nut for the April Fools gag but didn't necessarily hang around for the actual revived block. Hell, those viewers don't even consider what airs on Saturday to be "real" Toonami. To them, it ceased to exist the second it left weekday afternoons.

Like I said the most likely properties to actually work would be either Sailor Moon, YYH, or dare I say it, the original DBZ. Moon and DBZ, however, unless they really pushed hard for it, would not be the versions people remember. Those have long been redubbed, revised, and rescored. YYH in HD would be cool to see, but would that really draw people in considering it's age and length? Gundam Wing and G Gundam are other big nostalgic titles, but would they work once a week? Gundam titles haven't really hit big with modern Toonami so I can't see them making a case for it.

Honestly, I don't know if something like that would work out the way they hope. It would be an expensive venture that may be a dud. It would have to be a really cheap deal.

Toonami Can't thrive off Nostalgia Alone(something those people should understand)and if toonami was still airing weekday afternoons

we'd have heavily censored shows and  some of these shows wouldn't air at all such as Jojo's Bizarre adventure

would any of them truly be happy if we had what amounts to A 4kids version of toonami?....because that's what We'd get if toonami was still a weekday afternoon block on cartoon network

and I'm tired of people who think Toonami Isn't Toonami unless it's airing all retro content

Have they seen what happens to a block or even a television network that's entirely "Retro Content?"

it either dies or is rebranded to be something else completely

case in point

Nicktoons Network it was once A Channel for Old Nickelodeon Content and now it's just the dumping ground for shows nickelodeon doesn't like

you can't really hype up retro content that long eventually people stop caring and then you are up a creek without a paddle

so back to toonami...the same would apply

Nostalgia isn't a surefire plan for success

The Amount of Retro Networks that have come and gone are proof of that

28 minutes ago, brianycpht said:

I feel like they really should've been using this year to establish a different show in the 11pm hour. It's going to be quite a drastic change to the regular viewers come fall. Easing off their complete reliance of Family Guy to prop up the whole night (I'm not just talking about Saturday, I mean weeknights as well) would make it much easier later on. It seems like the ultimate plan is to front load the entire pre midnight hours with American Dad, Bob's, and Rick. I believe what they may do is air 3-4 unique episodes of each and ditch some if not all of the encores. I don't see how they keep 8:00 otherwise unless they want to use the Naruto/Jack hour there (also repeating at 5). To me having 3-4 Dad's a night is either leading up to them losing that hour completely or a preview of their strategy moving forward.I will admit though, as a up all night person, I'm intrigued by the possibility of a FOX-less late night portion of the block. There is such a massive catalog that they could easily program 5 or so hours. 

It seems like they really are set on keeping Super in the lead, perhaps even beyond the airing of episode 131. Maybe they were hoping by the time it cycled through, more Dragonball would be on the horizon. Demarco also hinted at the possibility of another "nostalgic" property taking that spot. Is that the only thing they think will hook in a casual viewer? I do wonder what they could possibly be hoping for. There's only a few heavy hitters that come to mind- Sailor Moon, YYH, Gundam (Wing or G) or perhaps even a re-airing of Bleach (maybe the last stretch). Would a viewer really come in for those week after week or just a few times and then go watch the rest on their own at a faster pace?

I"m getting mixed messages from them

on one hand they want something that draws in a casual audience as the lead show

but on the other hand they are thinking about a nostalgia pick to lead the block after dbs

that doesn't sound like something that would draw in a casual audience that doesn't really know about anime

they have to realize trying to pander to people who will never watch toonami no matter what they do isn't a smart idea

18 hours ago, PokeNirvash said:

Programming acting like morons, I'm sure. Really, I'm thankful that was rectified by the time season 4 showed up.

hopefully sooner rather than later they realize DBS Reruns remaining the lead show until it's run concludes isn't a smart idea....they aren't gonna find a better lead show than MHA S5

none of the originals will be it and a nostalgia fueled pick won't be either

18 hours ago, Daos said:

Well look.....they spent years cultivating a Dragonball fanbase, and now a lot of their viewers only come for Dragonball.

They chose the benefit of short term ratings for one show over long term survival.

https://comicbook.com/anime/news/netflix-ratings-anime-double-2020/

 

all because "DB Put toonami on the map!"  I Guess they are fine with people seeing toonami as just Dragon ball and nothing else

3 hours ago, EmpressAngel said:

Ratings. If it gets higher ratings that anything else would in that timeslot, there's literally no reason not to keep it there. This ain't a hard question to answer.

Unless You Live in Bizarro World it makes zero sense to not have MHA S5 as the lead show instead of two year old DBS Reruns

when it's likely it could outperform that crap if you just gave it the chance and didn't keep insisting nothing can do better than DBS Reruns

3 hours ago, OwlChemist81 said:

Probably not very great. I mean, while this season could be a mega blockbuster and anything can happen, MHA's ratings have a history of being inferior to Dragon Ball Super...

...OR DO THEY!?

In 2019, first Dub Premiere episodes of Dragon Ball Super were up against network premieres of MHA through about August. In all timeslots of MHA: 12 AM; 11:30 PM; and even 10:30 PM, DBS's consistent 11 PM showtime beat it. The same was of course true of 3:30 AM, it goes without saying.

But then a peculiar thing happened. After absolutely killing it in the ratings in dub premieres, DBS got a limited 4-episode encore of its conclusion from 10/12-11/2 at 11 PM, and was then replaced by MHA. MHA Season 4 beat it handily, 531K-475K. Then in 2020, MHA S4 premieres led the block, and even though they ended up in later timeslots, they did rather well, much better than the DBS encore that would rule the second half of the year at midnight. All episodes of MHA Season 4, whether premiere or rerun, averaged 546K. DBS, meanwhile, averaged only 435K when it led the block.

Of the 16 times DBS and AOT have aired back-to-back, DBS has beaten AOT 14/16 times in total viewers and beaten or tied it 10/16 in Adults 18-49 (tying 5 of those).

So, how will MHA Season 5 network premieres do in 2021? Will they be able to best DBS reruns at Midnight as AOT failed to do? Only time will tell, but I believe most evidence speaks that it's at least possible!

i still don't see them beating DBS Reruns because the trend is for the ratings to steadily decline after the first show and i don't see that changing

3 hours ago, OwlChemist81 said:

"On Adult Swim, the primetime FINAL SPACE was steady at 0.16, and the late-night line-up performed as follows:  DRAGON BALL up 0.01 to 0.18/342K, ATTACK ON TITAN up 0.02 to 0.17, FOOD WARS up 0.02 to 0.15, PROMISED NEVERLAND up 0.02 to 0.13, FIRE FORCE up 0.02 to 0.13, , BLACK CLOVER up 0.03 to 0.13, NARUTO up 0.02 to 0.11, and DEMON SLAYER up 0.03 to 0.10/174K."

Look at all those "ups". Dragon Ball Super leading the charge yet again. Some things never change--or do they? It will be interesting to see if MHA can shake things up next month. Perhaps if it consistently beats reruns of Super and that carries over to success for Dr. Stone, we MIGHT see a shakeup at some point? But for whatever reason, AOT just didn't have what it took, and we saw that play out week after week as DBS beat it consistently.

I'd be surprised if suddenly more people showed up for MHA than DBS Reruns because the ratings tend to decline after DBS and they never get any higher than what DBS Did

what are the chances people show up half an hour after toonami starts in droves to watch MHA S5?

unless these people stick around for the other shows what does toonami gain from catering to people who don't like anything that isn't dragon ball?

- Cosmo Samurai was greenlit pre-COVID and it's much cheaper to produce than the TIE stuff. CGI is expensive and is getting more expensive.

- They're still deciding what to do for the 25th anniversary next year.

- Stuff like Cosmo Samurai and the Rick and Morty anime shorts come from a separate budget and it is not tied to the budget for acquiring shows.

- We should be getting info about the original series in a couple months, such as premiere dates. He said everyone is pleased with how they're turning out, including the "high, higher-ups."

- As always, Toonami plans are known well in advance before the public knows. For example, there was a funny moment where Jason forgot that Dr. Stone season 2 is coming to Toonami because he had known for a while it was coming.

- And the last thing was the topic about DB: Super reruns. Basically, that's Kim Manning's decision and the reason why it's starting the block is what we have known for a while: it brings in the ratings. The Toonami people see more data than the general public and the show brings in the casual people to Toonami. Jason did say that they're aware that some people are unhappy about this and he said the show won't be at midnight "forever" but it's there for the foreseeable future. He also said that while he appreciates the die-hard fans of the block, they're still a television network at the end of the day and they need to bring in the eyeballs. He also mentioned that My Hero Academia reruns don't do well on the block compared to Super and he speculated it's because My Hero's audience is much younger, so they'll stream it compared to DB fans.

3 hours ago, OwlChemist81 said:

Maybe it was INTENDED to be a final season, but they couldn't get the timeslot in Japan in April for whatever reason.

there was no way 16 episodes would be able to fit in the conclusion of AOT(from what I've been hearing anyway)

5 hours ago, OwlChemist81 said:

Darn it, why do I always fall asleep right at the end!?

Yep, looks like they're gonna use Infernals to blow up the Nether, but for what purpose?

And you're probably right that this really raising the stakes for nowhere near the end of the story. Season 3 obviously hasn't been announced, because apparently David Productions can only work on ONE Toonami-bound show at a time, and it's JoJo Part 6's turn next!

Episode 45 - Fire Force - Anime News Network

2.5 stars? Man that's lowballing it, but clearly not one of the series' best episodes.

Yeah Jojo Part 6 will probably put fire force S3 on the backburner for quite sometime

so if anyone wants to continue this...be patient or read the manga

12 hours ago, DangerMouse said:

i find it funny how Hibana's in the opening but she's barely been in this season

1 hour ago, mochi said:

I think it's more that DBZ is the only other anime ubiquitous in the west besides Pokemon so even when people have already seen it and/or hate it, it still pulls in an audience

but what will replace it when it's rerun eventually ends? will they just restart from the beginning....

8 hours ago, Sketch said:

Yeah this probably isn’t at least mostly Jason’s decision. AS programming decides the schedule and contracts often dictate when shows can air.

AS schedules are a bunch of stubborn nimrods though and Jason will defend anything they do.

early on in the pandemic it made sense because they were desperate for any kind of content on the block and this helped act as filler

now....it's just weird   2 year old dbs reruns don't really help anyone  the dbs anime isn't returning anytime soon and people who watch dbs typically run away from any other show

You have to imagine adult swim isn't happy with that and this contract has put them in a very frustrating position

where the next lead show will most likely be something too niche to attract mainstream attention

all while MHA S5 lives in the shadow of DBS Reruns...

keeping the show as the lead show on the block doesn't help any other show it doesn't help toonami

because people who only like db will continue what they do...watch that rerun and then tune out

so how is this a smart business move?

I Have no idea what will be the lead show after super now....MHA S5 seemed like the obvious choice to take lead spot and demote DBS Reruns

but apparently toonami is too stubborn to not have DBS as the star show